on โ06-06-2020 08:50 AM
If you're fighting to protect people's lives, why not start by not risking the innocent lives of everyone elses. Find another time. I will have more respect for you. I was just saying the other day: Thank God that Australians aren't as crazy as Americans and we have at least some common sense not to choose this time to protest.
on โ11-06-2020 09:13 PM
@icyfroth wrote:
@chameleon54 wrote:
@icyfroth wrote:
@chameleon54 wrote:
@4channel wrote
@chameleon54 wrote:
Unfortunately there are too many inconsistencies and obvious anomalies in the position of the protesters. They have ruined any credibility they may have had and simply come across as a mob of hypocritical attention seekers....Unfortunately rationality and common sense flies out the window when politicall correctness enters the room..Sorry but I fail to see where the inconnsistencies and anomalies are. Even if it was a case of right or wrong to protest when the corona virus ius about doesn't make them lack credibility. Their actions were motivated by emotion. The main one that comes to mind is outrage. Care and concern are others.
No hyprocracy that I can see.
There are several glaring anomalies and inconsistencies. You make a number of well thought out and considered points, so I suspect you cant see the anomalies because you don't want to see them.
One glaring anomaly is that it is recognised by just about everyone that indigenous Australians have much worse health outcomes than non indigenous Australians.
Aboriginal community leaders have rightly been at pains to restrict movement of non community members into Aboriginal settlements due to concerns that if the Corona virus is brought into settlements it will be devastating due to the high incidence of chronic illness, lack of understanding of social distancing and poor access and use of established medical facilities.
By encouraging indigenous Australians to head to the state capitals and stand shoulder to shoulder with thousands of other indigenous and non indigenous people during a global pandemic when only ten people have been allowed at funerals is not only stupid in the extreme, but down right dangerous. The chances of a protester picking up the virus and infecting remote communities becomes a highly predictable outcome.
The Black Lives Matter rallies are directly endangering " black " communities.
Another anomaly that seems to have slipped your notice is that the slogan " black lives matter " and the rejection of the slogan " all lives matter " is very obviously racist.To suggest that some-ones life only matters if a person has a certain skin colour or racial origin is discriminatory and separatist. The Black lives Matter rallies are fighting racism with racism.True equality can only come when everyone regardless of age, sex, race or skin colour are treated equally. To truly encourage non discrimination, the Black Lives Matter proponents should be espousing the rights of everyone to be treated equally, not pushing seperatism and racial isolation.
I understand that " Black " people are currently over-represented in police harassment and deaths in custody, but so are a number of other minority groups such as those with mental illness, the homeless and the poor. Its not just a " black " problem, its a problem of persecution of all minorities by police forces globally.
And for the record, I have been one of the very few contributors to these forums who has been expressing concern about the issue of predudicial and dangerous police procedure consistently for many years. Most here have just jumped onto the bandwagon in the last few weeks since it became the pet project of the PC crowd. No doubt in a month or two you will all move onto the next, latest fashionable thing............. So from one of the old proponents on the subject............ Welcome aboard newbies !
Look. The Black Lives Matter is a real issue. I get that.
Thing is, we have an inherited problem here that was introduced by colonisation politics of preivous world powers, back in the day.
In todays world we recognise it and are shamed for it
Ok, Black/White relations are coming to a head. Why wouldn't they?
Still...moving forwad.(and I hate that term) we need to negotiate a balance between our black and white lives. We need to have respect for our white traditions as well as acknowledgeemnt for the suffering black ppl had to go through to uphold it.
Does that mean " We're all in this together ".........Sing along now............
...........Sorry !
ha haa...you should be sorry ya sad so and so..
you have to make a joke of it ya silly old dagwood, go hang your head in shame...
โ11-06-2020 09:18 PM - edited โ11-06-2020 09:20 PM
_________________________________________________________________________
@chameleon54 wrote:
There are several glaring anomalies and inconsistencies. You make a number of well thought out and considered points, so I suspect you cant see the anomalies because you don't want to see them.
One glaring anomaly is that it is recognised by just about everyone that indigenous Australians have much worse health outcomes than non indigenous Australians.
I'm not deliberately overlooking certain things as you suggest. Yes, the indigenous health issue is woeful. Australia is meant to be a modern Western country and a democracy. It's a modern Western country with a shameful history that continues to this very day. Because of colonisation plunder and the greed that goes with it, there's been a disparity between the original inhabitants and the later additions. Also the idea that Australia is a democracy is often debated.
If there was any real concern for the health of indigenous Australians there wouldn't be the woeful situation we see today. Did you know that Fluoride is toxic, it affects indigenous Australians worst of all. This toxin which doesn't really do anything for teeth anyway is dangerous to diabetics. It speeds up the destruction of the kidneys. Diabetes is rife in Indigenous communities.
@chameleon54 wrote:
Aboriginal community leaders have rightly been at pains to restrict movement of non community members into Aboriginal settlements due to concerns that if the Corona virus is brought into settlements it will be devastating due to the high incidence of chronic illness, lack of understanding of social distancing and poor access and use of established medical facilitieS.
By encouraging indigenous Australians to head to the state capitals and stand shoulder to shoulder with thousands of other indigenous and non indigenous people during a global pandemic when only ten people have been allowed at funerals is not only stupid in the extreme, but down right dangerous. The chances of a protester picking up the virus and infecting remote communities becomes a highly predictable outcome.
The Black Lives Matter rallies are directly endangering " black " communities.
Yes, the restrictions to aboriginal settlements is a good thing just as border restrictions. I've always supported that. I don't think the indigenous people at the protests were from those same remote communities anyway.
I disagree with you that the rallies are endangering Aboriginal community's. If they can bring to light the disparity between Indigenous and non- then that's a good thing.
@chameleon54 wrote:
Another anomaly that seems to have slipped your notice is that the slogan " black lives matter " and the rejection of the slogan " all lives matter " is very obviously racist.To suggest that some-ones life only matters if a person has a certain skin colour or racial origin is discriminatory and separatist. The Black lives Matter rallies are fighting racism with racism.True equality can only come when everyone regardless of age, sex, race or skin colour are treated equally. To truly encourage non discrimination, the Black Lives Matter proponents should be espousing the rights of everyone to be treated equally, not pushing seperatism and racial isolation.
I understand that " Black " people are currently over-represented in police harassment and deaths in custody, but so are a number of other minority groups such as those with mental illness, the homeless and the poor. Its not just a " black " problem, its a problem of persecution of all minorities by police forces globally.
I'm not an avid supporter of the Black Lives Matters movement as I think it may have been infiltrated and some nasties both black and white are using this as a "ride hitch" for their own agenda that is nefarious. Yes, all lives matter and I agree with you there. However the issue at hand is the racist apathy towards the killing of African Americans and the impunity these crimes are often committed with. So with the current issue, I can see why "Black Lives Matter" is the chosen slogan. I don't see it as fighting racism with racism. It's not an attack on white people, it's an attack on a broken system, no broken isn't the right word. It's an an attack on a system that has always been dysfunctional when it comes to fair treatment of African Americans.
I like to look at the bigger picture and see where things are heading and what could be done to change that direction. I believe that this is a NOW that needs to be addressed NOW and if it's given the right attention, a direction to chaos can be changed to a positive one.
Let's just look at two Australian cases. One was where an indigenous man's liver was near cleaved in half like cheese on a chopping block. Q: Any punishment? A: No!
The other was an indigenous man who died after almost being cooked to death in the back of a prison transport van. Anyone been made accountable?
And yes, all minorities globally are being persecuted by police. Perhaps this protest will be a lead-in to fixing other things.
@chameleon54 wrote:
And for the record, I have been one of the very few contributors to these forums who has been expressing concern about the issue of predudicial and dangerous police procedure consistently for many years. Most here have just jumped onto the bandwagon in the last few weeks since it became the pet project of the PC crowd. No doubt in a month or two you will all move onto the next, latest fashionable thing............. So from one of the old proponents on the subject............ Welcome aboard newbies !
I'm not one of the PC crowd or one of the "Feel good lefties". I'm not a newbie as such. I stick with my stance when it comes to speaking about things that are wrong. Some or most of the others who have spoken out against the injustices appear to have genuine concern IMO.
Palm Island death in custody: Community still struggling to deal with memories 10 years onBy Allyson Horn
Posted 19 NovNovember 2014, updated 19 NovNovember 201431 Jan 2018 - 12:15pm'Cooked' to death: Ten years after shocking death in custody, has anything changed?ByRangi Hirini
No, there have been no changes of any real significance.
on โ11-06-2020 09:29 PM
@icyfroth wrote:
@the_great_she_elephant wrote:Lythargr wrote: Apparently white lives dont matter as much
To whom is it apparent?
Not to you, obviously...
100% right, Icy. It has never been apparent to me that white lives matter less than black ones.
on โ11-06-2020 09:59 PM
on โ11-06-2020 10:05 PM
Sorry but I fail to see where the inconnsistencies and anomalies are. Even if it was a case of right or wrong to protest when the corona virus ius about doesn't make them lack credibility. Their actions were motivated by emotion. The main one that comes to mind is outrage. Care and concern are others.
No hyprocracy that I can see.
Is stupidity an emotion?
on โ11-06-2020 10:56 PM
@icyfroth wrote:
@joz*garage wrote:Soo, any new positive covid tests come up since these protests??
What a small man you turned out to be, Joe.
Why would you say such a thing? i was curious to find out if the virus has actually spread due to the protests
on โ12-06-2020 08:25 AM
on โ12-06-2020 08:26 AM
โ12-06-2020 08:59 AM - edited โ12-06-2020 09:00 AM
@lurker172602 wrote:
But what if both houses are on fire right now. What if we saw the shooting death by police of a man with mental illness armed with a pocket knife in Australia only a few weeks ago. No his life doesn't matter. He didn't fit the profile for this weeks Lefty feel good, PC. hug fest. There's nothing attractive about a person with mental health issues having a break down, so his life doesn't matter at all. In fact it matters so little that no-one else on this forum even mentions it.
The issue of police violence is not only a black issue. Its a minority issue. The answer isn't just to stop cops bashing black people. The answer is better recruitment procedures to weed out the cowboy, bullies who get off on victimising and abusing others before they put the badge on in the first place. The answer is to train police better so that they can restrain offenders without unnecessary violence. The answer is to supervise police " with history " better. And most importantly the answer is to have a GENUINE INDEPENDENT complaints and review process that investigates unconscionable conduct by police and has the teeth to act and remove the " legal fringe dwellers " from the force and lay formal charges against the worst offenders.
โ12-06-2020 09:48 AM - edited โ12-06-2020 09:49 AM
@lurker172602 wrote:
What if both houses are on fire, but the flag waving rah rah crowd only put the water hose on the house owned by the black man and stand back and watch the white mans house burn down........Isnt that a rather extreme form of discrimination and rascism ?