What makes a fact a fact?

[chuk_77]

People post news clips as fact but others disagree depending on who owns the paper

People quote TV and the "facts" are argued because media is bias

People post you tube videos and people argue its not fact

So, what does make a fact, a fact? How does it go from an opinion to an absolute fact? 

[nevynreally]

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@the_great_she_elephant wrote:

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@nevynreally wrote:

I have no idea what yours means either.

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Obviously not.

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Well, that was informative. And deep. And pretty much all I expected.

[imastawka]

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@nevynreally wrote:

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@imastawka wrote:

So many people channelling joanie..........

I find that rude and insulting. I don't agree with most of what joanie posts. But they have the right to. Comparing one poster to another is just rude. Don't have a response. Use a putdown.

And people wonder why this forum is dead.

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 Joanie's standard response is   'I don't understand'

My post was not in the least rude and insulting

[k0llectable5]

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If it's verifiable, it's fact.  Most media reports are heresay. Heresay is not fact. And it's also not necessarily fact  just because alot of people agree with it.  Then theres misinformation, where the commentator believes what he is saying is true but isn't and disinformation where the commentator is purposely lying to confuse the listener/reader.  

One thing I will say, it is hard to find 100% factual news anywhere. 

In August of 2014, Autism Media Channel published bombshell recordings of a CDC autism researcher who blew the whistle on systemic fraud and data-tampering inside the CDC. The main stream media, months later, kept a near total silence on the explosive story. But when CNN's health reporter condescended to parents of autistic children by insisting "vaccines do not cause autism" and adding, "some people don't hear this well," she accidentally triggered a social media video revolution. Parents began recording one minute videos documenting that their children were developmentally normal until they got a certain round of vaccinations.

It began on the evening of Aug. 27, when CNN aired a segment in which three anchors sought to dismiss all concern that vaccines could be unsafe or cause autism—citing “67 studies,” that showed otherwise. The question of whether vaccines could cause autism was alive because Dr William Thompson had issued a press release on Aug. 27 confirming that he had been part of a team that had altered data for a scientific study in order to reach the conclusion that vaccines do not cause autism.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/933954-autism-parents-reply-to-cnn-hear-this-well/sthash.6GNlJ5c8.dp...

(Hundreds of 30 second to 1 minute videos of parents with autistic kids) 

http://www.morganverkamp.com/august-27-2014-press-release-statement-of-william-w-thompson-ph-d-regar... (Some verification)

http://healthimpactnews.com/2015/obama-grants-immunity-to-cdc-whistleblower-on-measles-vaccine-link-... (some more) 

[nevynreally]

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@imastawka wrote:

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@nevynreally wrote:

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@imastawka wrote:

So many people channelling joanie..........

I find that rude and insulting. I don't agree with most of what joanie posts. But they have the right to. Comparing one poster to another is just rude. Don't have a response. Use a putdown.

And people wonder why this forum is dead.

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 Joanie's standard response is   'I don't understand'

My post was not in the least rude and insulting

But that's your opinion. Does that make it a fact?

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[nevynreally]

There was a report today released that breastfeed babies are smarter than non breastfed babies.  Stats can prove whatever your agenda is.

[imastawka]

Years ago there used to be a smart 4rse answer to the question

'what's a fact ?'   The answer had something to do with anatomy

But this is a G rated board

[k0llectable5]

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@nevynreally wrote:

Stats can prove whatever your agenda is.

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Thats true, I was just raising a point that even when alot of people are vehemently sure about vaccinations and the popular opinion is they are fine and not linked to autism, out pops someone like Dr Thompson to throw another spanner in the works.  

[ufo_investigations]

What makes a fact a fact?

Answer = You can believe me. I know everything! No need to question it because I know! LOL 🙂

[nevynreally]

Okay.

I am not other posters. The views I post are based on my own experiences, lived, read. I am no other poster. being accused of considering the hoops I suddenly had to go through tonight is interesting in the context of posts tonight. In summary. you get what you give. If thats what you want, all yours.

[i-need-a-martini]

Another good example of how people make assumption about percieved facts is the Welfare Reform thread.

The OP links to a Daily Telegraph article from a couple of days ago that makes some claims about jobless families. The article lists some statistics but doesn't reveal the source. Looks genuine enough though and I am sure the article will be copied time and time again now that welfare reform is on the federal govts agenda.

Took me a while but I found the source that the Daily Telegraph failed to mention - it is a report from 2009 that was tabled in Parliament back then. THe research was conducted by Peter Whiteford who has written fairly extensively about the need to cut welfare and is currently a consultant to the government on welfare 'reform'.

However, the statistics reported in the paper are not 100% true.

The statistic  that 12% of children under 14 are growing up in jobless households is sort of true. However, many of those households intervieweed were single mothers with preschool aged children - a time when it is near impossible for many to work. Also, 15 year old children were categorised as jobless if they didn't have a part time job. So the results are a little bit skewed in my opinion.

He makes a statement like this: 

Lone mothers are less likely to be employed than other mothers when their youngest child is below school age, and this is the group who have just experienced the largest drop in employment. This suggests the need to support part-time work amongst parents with pre-school children. But because these parents can receive Parenting Payments and are not required to actively look for work they may be less likely to access labour market support than parents with older children, who to date have been less severely affected by the labour market downturn.

His reforms include dropping Parenting Payments to push mothers with pre-school children into part time work.

He has an agenda. Therefore the results of his study can't be seen as truth.

Yet the Daily Telegraph used his 'facts' as a lead in to a sensationalist story about a family on welfare.