sterelising the disabled

[amalan11]

I was reading an article today (on the Daily telegraph site,Sydney)  about banning people from taking disabled children overseas to be sterilised.

It got me wondering why it cannot be done in Australia as in some cases I can understand why parents would want this done.

It is not a nice topic, but i think if a child is so disabled mentally or physically that they cannot care for themselves it is just adding a terrible burden to the family and child themselves if a pregnancy occurs.

I noticed the other point listed as a pro was to stop the child being sexually abused but I cannot see what difference being sterilised would make to that..as disgusting as it is it seems there are always deviates preying on these people .

I think it would surly be better to have a board of experts be able to allow sterilisation in some cases

In the article it talks about how sad it is that some women who have been sterilised want to have children later and collect prams and baby photos ect because they are so unhappy but if they have such issues I wonder how they would deal with a baby they had to give away  or abortion in the past if they had been unable to keep it.

sometimes I question if the rights of the individual outweigh commonsence

[*elizabeths-mum*]

I am finding it an odd coincidence that this thread is being discussed the same time as the the thread about the murder by an intellectually disabled mother of her child with the result that her disability has been considered in shortening her sentence.

While there were other factors, this was part of the Judges consideration:

'As anyone knows, the burdensome responsibilities of parenthood are not bestowed only upon those who are capable of meeting them. The offender was patently ill-equipped for the role and probably equally unable to recognise it. Mr Champion recorded her demonstrated intellectual disability that could have been expected to limit the offender's "judgment and learning and coping with stressful situations". The death of the deceased was in these circumstances the foreseeable and preventable consequence of equally foreseeable and preventable causes. '

[i-need-a-martini]

But not all intectually disabled people are unable to take care of a baby. There is a lady around the corner who has Downs and she has a baby. She's out the front with the baby most afternoons watching her husband as he works on people cars in the driveway. He has some kind of disability too not sure what.

The baby is a toddler now but is clearly loved.

Not sure what the story is as I don't stop to chat much but I think her mum lives there. Or its her house.

[*elizabeths-mum*]

No and not all people of normal intelligence are able to take care of a baby. I think the question of sterilisation relates more to intellectually disabled women who are unable to care for themselves. Do you know that your neighbour is intellectually disabled? A small proportion of people with Down syndrome are not although they may have the physical features common to the chromosomal anomaly. 

[donnashuggy]

When I had my first child I was in a bed next to a blind lady who was having her first child, her husband was blind as well, not partially either, she was always telling me to turn my television down. I have to wonder how she coped.

[phorum_junkie*]

There is a very big difference between being vision impaired and having a learning disability. I know a few couples where one or both of them have no vision at all and they have brought up their children, both sighted and unsighted, without any issues. 

[i-need-a-martini]

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@*elizabeths-mum* wrote:

No and not all people of normal intelligence are able to take care of a baby. I think the question of sterilisation relates more to intellectually disabled women who are unable to care for themselves. Do you know that your neighbour is intellectually disabled? A small proportion of people with Down syndrome are not although they may have the physical features common to the chromosomal anomaly. 

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She is impaired enough that she is incapable of having a conversation with me but beyond that I don't know.

But I suppose my issue with forced sterilisation is related to who makes the decision. 

[***super_nova***]

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@i-need-a-martini wrote:

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But I suppose my issue with forced sterilisation is related to who makes the decision. 

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There is a big difference between intellectually disabled person who may find it difficult to be a good parent and person who is so intellectually disabled that they cannot comprehend the meaning of periods, or how babies are made.  I have recently seen on TV interview with parents who want their daughter to have a hysterectomy because she has a mental age of about 3 or 4 years, gets distressed at the sight of blood, and removes her soiled pads in public.  For somebody like that taking care of a baby would be impossible.

However, there are plenty of disabled people who can take care of babies, some might need help because of their physical limits, but that does not stop them from being good parents.

 Nobody should be forced to be sterilised, but people who do not even understand the meaning of the world need somebody to make the decision, and while there should be some safeguards, IMO the existing laws are draconian.  They make life of carers, often elderly parents, so much more difficult.

[catsnknots]

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@donnashuggy wrote:

When I had my first child I was in a bed next to a blind lady who was having her first child, her husband was blind as well, not partially either, she was always telling me to turn my television down. I have to wonder how she coped.

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There is a well known couple here and they are both blind and both have guide dogs and have a beautiful child... they cope very well. 

I use to see them walking down the street with the pram hooked up in a special harness...

having a disability might make things a little harder but this couple seemed to cope fine. 

On the question on reducing sexual abuse if a woman has her period and needs a carer to change her pads then that is putting the woman as risk of abuse. Also they are asking carers to look into other methods of control such as implants to control periods... 

Some young people that have a disability can actually have accelerated learning and understanding as they get older and can then go on to lead productive lives and look after their own child. A young person going into a group home instead of staying in their families home often become very independent very fast. 

[1sweetap6v8]

Bad topic and you wont like my comment.

There are 7 billion people in the world ,  Do we really need the disabled ?.  You do realise if it was not for medical progress in the last 150 years a lot of these disabled people would not have survived.  So who is to blame.?

Unfortunately we as humans allow our compassionate side to win over when in fact maybe we should be a little more brutal as that in itself is real compassion for many.   Would you like to live life as a disabled.?  What would you want for yourself.? I know what I would want.

Im sorry but the simple answer is , they are damaged goods and nature would not allow these people to survive normally as it does with any animal that is born disabled or damaged.  Sorry born a disabled you should be disposed of humanly , Those made disabled threw accident and disease as long as they have there full wits about them and have had tme to see life as disabled before making THERE decision if they wish to continue or not, The reason I say this is because when you are first put in such a position it is completely normal to not want to go on for most so time is a must. But there are those no matter how long it is they no longer want to be here so who are we to say NO. If they decide to go on we have no choice but to see them threw, But new borns we have a choice.

This is a brutal world and if life for all of us changed tomorrow due to circumstances out of our control what happens to the disabled then?. I dont think people like Hitler would think to long or hard about that and neither will the next dictator who will have a similar attitude to Hitlers.

Millions are starving who are not disabled millions live in extream poverty and are not disabled millions need our help and are not disabled , Why do we care for those who nature deem damaged while so many that are not damged are being damaged because we turn a blind eye to there fait, Why because we think the little bit we do here for tham makes our inerself feel better when all it is is more smoke and mirrors.  And if they were not here they can not be abused buy anyone physically menally or sexually.  Stop trying to fix nature.

[cherry*135]

The main issue is with intellectually disabled persons. Physically disabled persons with no intellecutal disability would be able to make a decision themselves whether they have children or not.