Shipping Methods that meet criteria for PayPal Seller Protection?

[2012rly]

Hi, Can anyone tell me what methods of Australia Post parcel post meet the criteria for PayPal Seller Protection now that Registered is no longer available? Is Tracking sufficient (ie normal parcel post) or do you also need Signature? I rang PayPal, but couldn't seem to get a straight answer. Thanks!

[this-way-up]

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@digital*ghost wrote:

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If you wish me to engage with you in a respectful discussion, don't accuse me of doing something you're doing yourself, and don't do it in a condescending manner.

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I am sorry, I did not accuse you of anything...YOU condescendingly accused ME of not using the word "almost" as I stated, when in fact I had used the word "almost".

[digital*ghost]

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@this-way-up wrote:

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@digital*ghost wrote:

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If you wish me to engage with you in a respectful discussion, don't accuse me of doing something you're doing yourself, and don't do it in a condescending manner.

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I am sorry, I did not accuse you of anything...YOU condescendingly accused ME of not using the word "almost" as I stated, when in fact I had used the word "almost".

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I did not say you never used it, I showed it wasn't used in the points I was addressing. You have insinuated (more apt word than accused, granted), that I have not read / understood your post(s).

I am doing the same, but I do not feel that my tone is condescending. 

I will not participate in this line of the discussion any further as I have said all I am prepared to on the matter.

[thecatspjs]

I have paypal seller protection for item not received for every single thing I post.

No ifs, no buts,  no maybes, no mights.

I know it.   100% know it.

I can prove lodgement and full addressee details on every single parcel I post.    Whether click and send, pre-paid satchels, registered letter or my own packaging. 

That being said, I note I have voluntarily refunded buyers who have not received items and successfully pursued Aust Post for compensation, because they lost it - and it is not right that they are not held accountable often enough. 

[davewil1964]

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@this-way-up wrote:

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@digital*ghost wrote:

If PayPal issue a refund to the buyer, the refund the fees paid to them. If the payment was $50, then the $48~ is taken from the seller, and the remaining amount paid by PayPal.

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I have thought about it. The actual tracking method only confirms that "something" was sent and delivered.

A buyer can only claim either not received OR not as described... OK, not received is pretty easy. If the buyer did not get the item then they did not get it and all the tracking in the world will only confirm that "something" was delivered. That is why I used the word "almost". As for not as described, with out referring to any individuals, people have great difficulty in understanding what they read. I guess that is why we see so many listings that simply say "see the photos".

I can assure you, because I have a screen shot of my account to prove it. Paypal take the full amount paid by the buyer including postage and fees the very second that a buyer clicks on the refund button. The funds are placed "on hold". If by chance the buyer does not comply with the proccess and the funds are given back to the seller, the amount given back is less the fees...and I have the screen shots to prove it ! If the buyer does actually get the refund it includes the fees that Paypal have been paid, Paypal do not give the fees back to the seller.

The main question the OP is asking, is how to qualify for seller protection when Paypal are not giving a straight answer...The answer is - It is "almost" immpossible to qualify for seller protection and that is why Paypal are not giving a straight answer 🙂

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Please ascertain the facts before you spread more misinformation. If a Paypal transaction is reversed, the fees are also reversed. It does however show as a separate transaction.

As cats, said, there are ways of complying with seller protection for EVERY item you post. I don't bother with letters, but all my others are C&S and I am definitely covered, including for loss. I think. They haven't updated that C&S term yet have they, cats?

[this-way-up]

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@thecatspjs wrote:

I have paypal seller protection for item not received for every single thing I post.

No ifs, no buts,  no maybes, no mights.

I know it.   100% know it.

I can prove lodgement and full addressee details on every single parcel I post.    Whether click and send, pre-paid satchels, registered letter or my own packaging. 

That being said, I note I have voluntarily refunded buyers who have not received items and successfully pursued Aust Post for compensation, because they lost it - and it is not right that they are not held accountable often enough. 

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OK...So that covers "item not received"...Good.

Allow me to give a real life example.

Several years ago I bought a battery from Kmart. I got it because it was cheap. It was reduced to $15 from well over $200. At that price checking does not matter, I just got it. When I got home I found that althought it looked like my Sony camera battery, it was in fact a different model.

A few months ago, I found that battery in amongst other stuff I am clearing out of my garage and listed it for auction on eBay. Start price $14.99. It did sell and the buyer was happy and left good FB for me...and we are both happy.

However, before it sold I got an email from another buyer asking if they could buy it and if it did not work could they smash it with a hammer and give me photo proof of it being smashed and get a refund...He was on my BBL before I even finished reading his email or sending my reply of "No".

Believe it or not...He would have qualified for a refund through Paypal if he gave photo proof of destruction !!! As an item Not As Described !!!. Think about it...He has an old battery that needs replacing and could you tell the difference between an old battery and a new battery when it's been smashed with a hammer ???

So you can prove delivery...Good...That leaves the buyer with "not as described". We do not need to look very far to see that even just one word can change the entire meaning for a buyer. Your item description can ALMOST mean something completely different to the buyer than what you actually stated in your description...And if a buyer files a Not As Described claim the seller has ALMOST no chance of qualifying for seller protection ! 🙂

[thecatspjs]

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@this-way-up wrote:

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...And if a buyer files a Not As Described claim the seller has ALMOST no chance of qualifying for seller protection ! 🙂

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Yes, indeed they might have got protection as it appears you still have not thought that in that situation you only would have only had to provide a copy of the ebay message as evidence of fraud to be considered in any paypal dispute..... but its hypothetical isn't it, as it didn't happen. 

IMO those sellers that have a poor track record with multiple paypal claims from buyers may strike problems with qualifying for protection on an ongoing basis.

[digital*ghost]

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@this-way-up wrote:

.And if a buyer files a Not As Described claim the seller has ALMOST no chance of qualifying for seller protection ! 🙂

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Not almost, actually.

There is technically no seller protection available for SNAD claims.

Note the following from the PayPal user agreement:

PayPal Seller Protection Policy
Eligibility
S3.1 If you are a seller, we may not deduct funds from your account in connection with a Reversal where the following requirements are met for a transaction:
The item is sold on eBay;
You receive payment via PayPal;
You provide us with valid Proof of Shipment; and
The item is sent to the address we specify on the payment notification or "Transaction Details Page" which can be accessed by logging in to your PayPal account

PayPal seller protection is a provision for INRs, not SNAD.

In SNAD claims, there is a "winner" and a "loser" - there is no provision for the "loser" to retain / regain the funds. (Although the decision can be appealed, and a discretionary payment issued).

In the case of a chargeback, the buyer can win but the seller still retains the funds - that's what seller protection is.

Buyer and Seller protections work separately and individually - they are not inherently intertwined, nor counter-act one another point by point. 

[this-way-up]

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@digital*ghost wrote:

 

In the case of a chargeback, the buyer can win but the seller still retains the funds - that's what seller protection is.

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OK...So in the case of a chargeback, the buyer can win. I assume you mean get a refund? and the seller can retain the funds, I assume you mean keep the money? and that's what seller protection is !!!

wool - eyes - over - pull ... just a sec I am trying to put these words together to make sence... over - wool - pull - eyes ... I will get it in a sec, just wait give me a chance... pull - eyes - wool - over...

I give in...How do you make the words pull - wool - over - eyes make sence?

[phorum_junkie*]

Sorry but that is exactly what seller protection is about, if you have proof that you have sent the item to the address on the Paypal transaction page then you are indeed covered and if the buyer is able to prove to Paypal's satisfaction that it has not been delivered although AP claim it has then Paypal will cover the refund. If it shows as undelivered then the seller should be taking that up with AP and the buyer ceetainly shouldn't have to go tot the lengths of a chargeback to get their refund.

You can poo poo the facts all you want but those of us who have been selling for many, many years and using Paypal since its inception can attest to the fact that we have successfully defended claims and chargebacks when we have used the correct delivery products. For today those are mainly click & send, tracking with signature required, eparcel, express parcel (not satchel) and Platinum Express.

For some cheaper items that can be posted as large letters I will take the risk of just sticking a stamp on but in those cases I refund without question so there is no need for a buyer to even open a dispute never mind initiate a chargeback.

[davewil1964]

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@this-way-up wrote:

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@thecatspjs wrote:

I have paypal seller protection for item not received for every single thing I post.

No ifs, no buts,  no maybes, no mights.

I know it.   100% know it.

I can prove lodgement and full addressee details on every single parcel I post.    Whether click and send, pre-paid satchels, registered letter or my own packaging. 

That being said, I note I have voluntarily refunded buyers who have not received items and successfully pursued Aust Post for compensation, because they lost it - and it is not right that they are not held accountable often enough. 

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OK...So that covers "item not received"...Good.

Allow me to give a real life example.

Several years ago I bought a battery from Kmart. I got it because it was cheap. It was reduced to $15 from well over $200. At that price checking does not matter, I just got it. When I got home I found that althought it looked like my Sony camera battery, it was in fact a different model.

A few months ago, I found that battery in amongst other stuff I am clearing out of my garage and listed it for auction on eBay. Start price $14.99. It did sell and the buyer was happy and left good FB for me...and we are both happy.

However, before it sold I got an email from another buyer asking if they could buy it and if it did not work could they smash it with a hammer and give me photo proof of it being smashed and get a refund...He was on my BBL before I even finished reading his email or sending my reply of "No".

Believe it or not...He would have qualified for a refund through Paypal if he gave photo proof of destruction !!! As an item Not As Described !!!. Think about it...He has an old battery that needs replacing and could you tell the difference between an old battery and a new battery when it's been smashed with a hammer ???

So you can prove delivery...Good...That leaves the buyer with "not as described". We do not need to look very far to see that even just one word can change the entire meaning for a buyer. Your item description can ALMOST mean something completely different to the buyer than what you actually stated in your description...And if a buyer files a Not As Described claim the seller has ALMOST no chance of qualifying for seller protection ! 🙂

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You are selling a battery that you know doesn't work? Any issues that arise are entirely your own fault.

I have given you many benefits of the doubt. You claim to be an experienced member, yet continually post erroneous information.

This can only lead to one conclusion - you live under a bridge and eat billy goats.

Edit: And I suspect don't eat very often, given your MO.