Import GST charge calculation based on pre-discount price, this doesn't seem right?

[foxfrontier]

Ebay seems to be charging GST based on the "pre-discounted price", for example I purchased an item..

Item Price: $10.38

I used a 5% discount voucher (coupon code), so effectviely $9.86 pre-tax

Credit card charges

1) 9.86 (paid to seller)

2) 1.04 (paid to ebay for "GST")

Total $10.90 charges

If I were to buy a 10.38 +10% GST item in any Australian store it would cost = $11.42

Then if I get a 5% discount it would = $10.85

Not $10.90.. so there is currently a 5 cent error in ebay's favour.

I'm not worried about my 5c of course, but multiply that by the whole of Australia and ebay is skimming a tidy profit there!!

For me the reason this is annoying though, is that I buy items for my business and because the tax is not adding up to 10%, my accounting package requires me to jump through hoops to reconcile it.

Fair enough it it were "correct", but I don't think ebay is correct in this calculation?

[*tippy*toes*]

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@foxfrontier wrote:

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@gutterpunkz05 wrote:

3. ... listed on ebay.com.au... when you spend $70 or more in one transaction...

 My thought exactly,   according to this coupon, if you dont spend  $70.00  you get zilch.  But at least he/she now knows where to find

T&Cs,  

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I know you might find it hard to believe the concept of "anothr item", so here's a screencap of my order.. probably visible in my history anyway.. lucky I didn't buy anything too embarassing this time.. 😜

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Oh shart, I've been wanting one of those scientific experement thingies for ages, but the ones I saw were so expensive. I'll have to check out that seller. Thanks for posting that screengrab.

[foxfrontier]

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@k1ooo-slr-sales wrote:

it showed on my other ID “My eBay” page as a voucher that is accessed via a “Redemption code”.

The T&Cs probably used the ‘d’ word, but I see it for what it is which is a rebate/redemption/gift/subsidy and is in no way shape or form a ‘discount’.

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OMG, I'll give you some basic advice, when reading legal contracts and such, take the word as it's "written" not what you want/expect/assume it to mean.. if the written word doesn't fit, question it, maybe get it changed.. the point of this thread..

[*tippy*toes*]

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@foxfrontier wrote:

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@*tippy*toes* wrote:

I am here because I want to be. I am the CEO of a large multi national company. I earn an insane amount of money. Coming here gives me an outlet where I don't have to think too hard. I like to help people.

The long term members here know far more about how eBay works than the people in the call centres. If you didn't treat us like complete morons, then we might be willing to help a bit more.

You want the fine print, find it yourself. It's there. Why should one of us do all the hard work for you? 

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Wow, not only does eBay have random people doing their support for them, they have esteemed CEO's dropping in too.. funny how someone in your grand position is not even slighly concerned about the tax law.. 😜

I'll give you a hint, I've looked and by this stage I am pretty sure the fine print doesn't exist publically, but I am not an eBay expert as you all are, so I am asking that "instead of listing off your internet credentials", that you just screencap or link to the fine print that explains in detail how the voucher is handled under the new GST imports system.. which entity is funding the discount and why aren't they issuing the required parchments.. seems simple, it really isn't though.. and probably why eBay haven't published it. 😉

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There are all types here. We have doctors, lawyers, nurses, business managers, CEO's, lawn mowers, cleaners, retired, you name it. The thing with these forums is, you remain completely anonymous. We are all the same. 

As for my spare time, that is mine to choose as I please. Why shouldn't I be allowed to kick back after a long day? Other people in my position will go and have a round of gold, or go to the gym. I like to have a good old bludge.

I sell on eBay. A LOT. Every cent I make from my sales goes to my sponser kids in Thailand and Burma. They also get 10% of my annual income (which is 7 figures usually). 5% of my weekly salaries goes towards multiple charities that I support (mostly animal charities).

Don't assume that the people who frequent these forums are lazy dole bludgers, with no respect for anything in life. Being female, I am able to multi-task. I can read these forums, list items for sale, catch up on emails and social media, and watch TV, all at the same time.

Now, on that note, I am starving to death after not long getting home from work, so am going to throw a bag of popcorn in the microwave. Even executives want to eat some nice stuff occasionally.

[foxfrontier]

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@*tippy*toes* wrote:

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Oh shart, I've been wanting one of those scientific experement thingies for ages, but the ones I saw were so expensive. I'll have to check out that seller. Thanks for posting that screengrab.

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Good one.

[imastawka]

Edited......ne'er mind................

[k1ooo-slr-sales]

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@foxfrontier wrote:

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@k1ooo-slr-sales wrote:

it showed on my other ID “My eBay” page as a voucher that is accessed via a “Redemption code”.

The T&Cs probably used the ‘d’ word, but I see it for what it is which is a rebate/redemption/gift/subsidy and is in no way shape or form a ‘discount’.

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OMG, I'll give you some basic advice, when reading legal contracts and such, take the word as it's "written" not what you want/expect/assume it to mean.. if the written word doesn't fit, question it, maybe get it changed.. the point of this thread..

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OMG . . . . . take a chill pill

T&Cs on a $20 voucher as a legal contract . . . . . man . . . . . . I got some freebies from eBay . . . . . . . I don’t consider T&Cs as a legally binding contract, they are a set of rules i.e. if you want $20 from us you must do this . . . . . . which I did and I got freebies.

I don’t give a toss if the company that widely uses the phrase “free postage” on item pages uses the word ‘discount’ on the T&Cs of vouchers. I don’t expect any adverse actions/ramifications resulting from me seeing the voucher as a rebate/subsidy/gift and not a discount!

Now, when I recently signed up for a two year contract for my mobile phones I did read the contract and take words for their true meaning, but eBay T&Cs . . . . . pffffft!

[foxfrontier]

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@*tippy*toes* wrote:

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Don't assume that the people who frequent these forums are lazy dole bludgers, with no respect for anything in life. Being female, I am able to multi-task. I can read these forums, list items for sale, catch up on emails and social media, and watch TV, all at the same time.

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One again, waaaay off the mark tippy!!!

I'm not saying you shouldn't "forum up" in your spare time, just maybe consider finding a forum that's of more value to society (there are forums out there in need of you!!) and let eBay pay for the support team they should have. That's all, no slight on peoples motives. Not calling anyone lazy.. defintely never said anyone was anything akin to a dole bludger. I'm just geniuinly sad and a little disturbed, that you guys choose to give your spare time away freely to eBay, to solve eBay's customer's problems for them, but each to their own I guess.

[digital*ghost]

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@foxfrontier wrote:

I'm not saying you shouldn't "forum up" in your spare time, just maybe consider finding a forum that's of more value to society (there are forums out there in need of you!!) and let eBay pay for the support team they should have. That's all, no slight on peoples motives. Not calling anyone lazy.. defintely never said anyone was anything akin to a dole bludger. I'm just geniuinly sad and a little disturbed, that you guys choose to give your spare time away freely to eBay, to solve eBay's customer's problems for them, but each to their own I guess.

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Not answering for anyone else...

eBay's customers are (at least potentially) my customers. The problems that are experienced, discussed and (hopefully) solved via community particpation therefore has the potential to make my job easier - either because a buyer learns how to do something that can otherwise be a massive time suck to troubleshoot and resolve on a case by case basis for god knows how many buyers and sellers, or because I learn to do something by reading, checking, or asking questions.

In an ideal world, ebay customer service reps would have in depth knowledge of the policies and inner workings of every single site that they run and could solve all of the problems that customers encounter (be they buyers or sellers, or both). But the world is far from ideal, and eBay even less so. 

Aside from the practical side of things, eBay reps aren't going to say "well, did you know [insert relevant insight here]", or "have you considered this from the seller's / buyer's perspective...." if a member is angry about something from an extraordinarily subjective perspective. They're not going to be able to give members effective tools and strategies to deal with problematic situations where the best advice comes from others who have experienced the same thing, and they're not going to tell members about alternative options available to them to resolve problems. 

Sure, ebay benefits from the members here, but you speak as though those who participate get nothing out of it, and you're suggesting that there are better, more noble pursuits, which, apart from being ignorant to the fact that people don't spend all day, every day here, leaving no room for anything else, it is also by virtue - whether you recognise it or not, and despite your protestations - a narrow-minded judgement on those who participate and attempt to help those who are experiencing problems. I suspect that was your intention though.

My interpretation may be off-base, they certainly have been before, but your posts actually read to me like you're trying to find a nicer (or perhaps more clever) way of saying "get a life", which is the most unoriginal and pointless of insults that is hurled at forum regulars with high post counts when the hurler decides they don't like what's being posted. If so, get better. 

[k1ooo-slr-sales]

I look at those ‘get a life’ type comments as a distraction or diversion used when a poster’s stance can not be sustained . . . . . . they start playing the man so to speak!

[countessalmirena]

@foxfrontier,

You mentioned that you're not sure about who is offering the voucher / who is paying the difference between what you pay the seller and at what price the seller's item was listed (ie., the amount at which the seller's item was sold). From the terms and conditions of the first few voucher codes you've listed:

❝Offer Period. This offer is available for a limited time only, for as long as it is advertised by eBay on www.ebay.com.au (“Offer Period”). eBay reserves the right to cancel the offer at any time. [...] This code cannot be used in conjunction with any other eBay offer, coupon or voucher. [...]  eBay rights. Without limiting other remedies and in addition to eBay’s rights under the User Agreement, eBay reserves the right to disallow or reverse a discount or prohibit access to this offer [...] eBay reserves the right to vary the terms and conditions of the offer at its reasonable discretion ...❞

While eBay's terms and conditions for this offer doesn't specifically say, "eBay are the ones making this offer and the offer amount will be payed by eBay", everything in the red portions of the text leads inescapably to the conclusion that eBay are indeed the ones making the offer and that eBay are the ones who will be paying the offer amount if a buyer enters the redemption code at the time of purchase of eligible items. Indeed, I can't interpret the words "eBay offer, coupon or voucher" in any other way.

You might be interested in reading Paying taxes on eBay purchases. In particular:

❝The order value (item price + postage costs) goes directly to the seller as usual, and eBay remits the GST portion to the Australian Taxation Office (ATO).❞

This is relevant in establishing that it's the order value that goes to the seller (not the price that you pay) is the value on which eBay collects GST and remits to the ATO. For instance, if you use a $100 eBay gift card (given to you as a Christmas present by a friend or family member) to pay for a low-value imported item that is, let's say, AUD 79.49 (item plus shipping), for the purposes of the customs value of the item it doesn't matter that you actually paid nothing for the item by credit card, cash, PayPal balance or eCheque (from your bank account via PayPal).

Are you purchasing items on eBay for business purposes? It's a clumsy process; eBay do mention that you can contact them with the relevant details, although they don't say whether this is to be done post-purchase or pre-purchase.

❝Information for business purchasers
If you are registered for GST, then GST will not apply to the sale of low value goods that you import for use in your business in Australia. Please review the business purchaser requirements on the ATO website, then contact us with the following information:

• Your ABN (eBay will check that it is active and registered for GST);
• That the order was intended for use in your business in Australia.❞

This might be of interest to you: Do you import goods worth A$1,000 or less?

❝Note that not all receipts that have GST applied will be tax invoices. They will need to contain an ABN to be considered a tax invoice. Overseas suppliers may be registered in the simplified GST system and have an ARN instead of an ABN.❞

The ATO address the question of an invoice to customers who are consumers.

❝You are not required to issue a tax invoice or adjustment note to your customers. If you choose to issue a tax invoice (which you can only do if you have an ABN), this will have all of the required information.❞

Also, in the eBay User Agreement:

❝If you are a buyer, you may see "GST may apply" when viewing items on eBay that are located overseas. You acknowledge and agree that if you buy a low value item on eBay from outside Australia, you will be charged 10% GST on top of the seller's item price (applied in your cart and at checkout).❞

This makes it unambiguous and clear that the GST is charged as a component of the seller's item price, not the price that you pay if you have any sort of voucher or redemption code.

I suspect (but can't confirm from personal experience) that the invoice that you receive from the eBay system will be sufficient for the purpose of GST compliance. It's clumsy, but it seems to me to meet the requirements that the ATO have set out for overseas sellers selling to Australian buyers.