GERMANY incest between siblings

[nero_bolt]

GERMANY’S national ethics council wants to allow incest between siblings

German Ethics Council votes in favour of allowing incest between siblings 

GERMANY’S national ethics council wants to allow incest between siblings, saying the risk of disability in children isn’t enough to warrant the law.

The Independent reports that the council made the recommendation after reviewing the case of Patrick Stuebing, a man who was adopted as a child and met his half-sister when he was 24 and she was 16.

The pair have four children together, however he was jailed for three years in 2008 and his sister, Susan Karolewski, was only allowed to keep one out of their four children.

Two of the children are disabled although it is unclear if that is a result of their parents being related.

Overnight, the German Ethics Council recommended that Section 173 of the German criminal code, which makes incest an offence under which offenders can be jailed for years, be repealed.

The chairman of the council, Christiane Woopen, was among the 14 members voting in favour of repealing the law, while nine people voted for the ban to continue and two abstained.

“The majority of the German Ethics Council is of the opinion that it is not appropriate for a criminal law to preserve a social taboo,” the council said. “In the case of consensual incest among adult siblings, neither the fear of negative consequences for the family, nor the possibility of the birth of children from such incestuous relationships can justify a criminal prohibition.

“The fundamental right of adult siblings to sexual self-determination has more weight in such cases than the abstract protection of the family,” the council added. “Incest between siblings appears to be very rare in Western societies according to the available data but those affected describe how difficult their situation is in light of the threat of punishment.”

Elisabeth Winkelmeier-Becker, a spokeswoman for Angela Merkel’s CDU party, said the abolition of the law against incest would send the wrong message.

“Abolishing criminal punishment against incestuous actions within a family would go completely against protecting the undisturbed development of children,” she told Deutsche Welle.

The Ethics Council’s recommendation only covered incest between siblings and members did not recommend decriminalising sex between parents and children.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/lifestyle/relationships/german-ethics-council-votes-in-favour-of-al...

[patchoo78]

I wonder what they will be saying in Germany when the disabilities become more apparent after the gene pool gets more and more diluted? Yes they are consenting adults, but the kids born in such a union aren't and shouldn't have to explain to people why their Father is also their Uncle (assuming that incestuous relationships are the exception rather than the norm)

[patchoo78]

It's already 14 in some places. and younger in others.. What's your point?

Can you provide any proof that gay rights is in any way responsible for a law against incest being repealed? I'd also like some info on how you think it could affect the age of consent. Being that you saw these things coming a while ago you are clearly an expert on the subjects

[***super_nova***]

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@xxpelxx wrote:

Who will be able to pinpoint genetic siblings in a few years? Unless they are registered by the same parent, it will be bedlam regarding incest.

IVF, surogacy, donor eggs and sperm. All those things happening in different countries and most have no acurate way of keeping tab on proper registration.

How many sisters and brothers will become couples in future and not know how closely they are related?

It's a small world.

Erica

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The possibility of that is statistically minute.  But I think that genetic parents should be identified somewhere in child's records, so people can find out  their genetic medical history and where their ancestors came from .  Some people do not want to know, but others do.  I was not overly interested until couple of years ago, and then, when I did our family tree, and hit a dead end on one branch back in early 1800s I was devastated LOL

Anyway, maybe it will be advisable in future to have genetic test done before people get married, and to determine whether people are related or not is one thing that can be done, and is not all that expensive.  But as people nowadays move so much, around the country and around the world, to marry your sibling is less likely, than it would have been in the past.  When people were born and died in the same town, if somebody had a child out of wedlock that child would  most likely be known to the person's other kids.

[the_great_she_elephant]

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@patchoo78 wrote:

I wonder what they will be saying in Germany when the disabilities become more apparent after the gene pool gets more and more diluted? Yes they are consenting adults, but the kids born in such a union aren't and shouldn't have to explain to people why their Father is also their Uncle (assuming that incestuous relationships are the exception rather than the norm)

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If incest between siblings was not illegsal then would explaining the father/uncle aspect of your ancestry be any more traumatic than explaining why you had two fathers or two mothers. The 'not fair on the kids' scenario was also being pushed as an argument against black/white marriages when I was a teenager  in England. 

[chuk_77]

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@***super_nova*** wrote:

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@xxpelxx wrote:

Who will be able to pinpoint genetic siblings in a few years? Unless they are registered by the same parent, it will be bedlam regarding incest.

IVF, surogacy, donor eggs and sperm. All those things happening in different countries and most have no acurate way of keeping tab on proper registration.

How many sisters and brothers will become couples in future and not know how closely they are related?

It's a small world.

Erica

---

The possibility of that is statistically minute.  But I think that genetic parents should be identified somewhere in child's records, so people can find out  their genetic medical history and where their ancestors came from .  Some people do not want to know, but others do.  I was not overly interested until couple of years ago, and then, when I did our family tree, and hit a dead end on one branch back in early 1800s I was devastated LOL

Anyway, maybe it will be advisable in future to have genetic test done before people get married, and to determine whether people are related or not is one thing that can be done, and is not all that expensive.  But as people nowadays move so much, around the country and around the world, to marry your sibling is less likely, than it would have been in the past.  When people were born and died in the same town, if somebody had a child out of wedlock that child would  most likely be known to the person's other kids.

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Donor eggs/sperm is recorded in Australia. You also need to agree to tell the child at 16 if they are the result of a donor