Moving into COVID-Normal...? Preparing for a post-COVID world, or "Living with COVID-19"

[countessalmirena]

We're not there yet. We're not yet at a stage where we can truly consider the world to have moved to COVID-normal. But we can see it on the horizon, and we can start to live in a way that is locally "living with COVID-19", barring any setbacks with more virulent or more infectious strains of SARS-CoV-2.

This is due to the vaccines that have been developed, approved, and administered in Australia and in many parts of the world.

If you read the thread State by State, Australia vs Elsewhere, in the age of COVID-19 and beyond, particularly in reference to the Australian CHO Prof. Paul Kelly's opinion piece, that article in the post to which I've linked raises some interesting points.

It brings to the forefront of my mind a perception that the deaths and adverse outcomes he mentions are not acceptable. In the same way, I do not consider any preventable deaths as acceptable. It may be a pragmatic reality that such deaths and adverse outcomes occur; however, there are simple things we can do to limit those outcomes.

I have been advocating for certain hygiene measures and air purification measures for some time. That has to step up now. Some of these measures cost absolutely nothing; some will require some financial outlay. But what is the cost of human life?

• We must keep up the hand hygiene, and pass on those lessons to the next generation and the generation beyond that. COST: negligible. (Soap and water; ~70% alcohol-containing hand sanitiser; alcohol wipes for doors, rails, high touch areas, to prevent transmission by fomites)
• It would be a good idea always to have a P2/N95 mask with us in the event of having respiratory symptoms, or being in the presence of anyone with such symptoms. COST: negligible for close-fitting cloth masks  washed daily. Higher cost if using reusable P2/N95 masks, and higher still if using single-use P2/N95 masks. Highest cost if test-fitted. (For immunocompromised individuals or those in close contact with such individuals or working in medical/health care settings, such a cost is not only affordable, but justified.)
• If we wear a mask (so, presumably in a risky setting) and in the course of doing so TOUCH OUR MASK, such as adjusting it, or even fleetingly coming into contact with the outside of the mask, we must as soon as possible sanitise our hands. Do not touch your eyes or your ear or anyone else or another surface before sanitising your hands. COST: nothing.
• There are crowded or high density settings that are unnecessary and can be avoided; maintain social distancing if possible and if appropriate. In social friendly settings, once we can relax and get back to hugging people and shaking hands, there will always be a risk but that is part of the price of being social beings and enjoying human relationships. COST: nothing.
• If we experience symptoms of illness, we must not have the attitude of soldiering on. We must STAY HOME, and get tested for COVID-19 if our symptoms are associated with those of COVID-19. COST: unknown. This may result in more sick days, but these sorts of things are the reason for us having sick days - not to "chuck a sickie" and hoof off to the cricket or the footie.
• If we are unwell, we MUST NOT VISIT HOSPITALS or AGED CARE or ANY INDIVIDUAL WHO IS VULNERABLE TO INFECTION. This includes stomach upsets and diarrhoea. Hospitals have had signs up warning visitors of precisely this for many years, but visitors persistently disregard this or talk themselves out of caring. That can no longer happen. We must stay away if we have or have recently had those symptoms, or we run the risk of bringing severe sickness or worse to the people we love most. COST: nothing.
• If you have visitors to your home, open up your windows. This will increase ventilation and lower the risk of transmission of airborne viruses. COST: nothing.
• Get a good HEPA air purifier if this is affordable within your budget. COST: variable, but  you can certainly get a good quality air purifier for $500 or perhaps a little more. There are mobile air purifiers available so that you can move it to where you are, thus maximising its effectiveness. Make sure it is big enough for the area, otherwise it will not provide the required purification effectiveness.
• Now that rapid antigen tests are available, they should be used in appropriate settings. They are not a substitute for a nasopharyngeal swab, but they have their uses.

We should attempt to make Australia a nation of healthy individuals, but this is an immense task. Being healthy and fit reduces risk factors, so it does make sense for us to optimise our state of fitness. COST: I could say "nothing", but the truth is that this is a magic health outcome that GPs and nutritionists have been trying to achieve for a very long time. Ah well, that's a discussion for another day.

All of these measures can only help us in this Delta-variant world if the great majority are vaccinated.

And... of course... we have a responsibility to make those vaccines available to each nation and each individual. If we don't help the poor, not only is that our moral shame but it is an ongoing risk to every single one of us.

[domino-710]

What - no mention of an increase in valuation of your ' remote ' farm. 

[4channel]

Further to my previous post  .. .. Throughout the course of this clip below, we see accounts of death and physical destruction from the "vaccine".

Senator Johnson Expert Panel on Federal Vaccine Mandates and Vaccine Injuries
249,498 views Nov 2, 2021

SenatorRonJohnson  
32.6K subscribers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lepqvdXoA2E

Listening to Ernest Ramirez at about 45:00 is beyond heartbreaking. His pride and joy, his only son who he raised on his own died as a result of the vaccine.

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NEWS

UPDATE: GoFundMe de-platforms dad whose

only son died after Pfizer jab

GoFundMe said that Ernest Ramirez’s fundraiser in honor of his son, who died shortly after taking the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine, fell under ‘prohibited conduct.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/gofundme-de-platforms-dad-whose-only-son-died-after-pfizer-jab/

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This info that is being presented in Senator Ron Johnson's clip is just a fraction of what is happening to people out there. Most of the participants are for vaccines. As painful as it is to watch, this clip is a must. I'm still in support for some vaccines and I believe there should be an optional one for this corona virus. But damn it, forcing, coercing people to take one still in the experimental stages is just plain wrong!

Listening to Patrick Whelan at about 1:35:50. he says a test revealed that one of "vaccine" encodes the same viral spike protein that causes most of the organ damage outside of the lungs in people that are actually infected with the virus. This is what happens when testing is inadequate. There can be, there is no substitute for time and in years to come, who knows what will manifest itself. This is new technology and even the six to ten to fifteen years it takes to properly test a vaccine may not even be enough.

Vaccine injury aside, we have to look at the psychological impact of what has been taking place. The mental anguish experienced by people who have been denied the choice whether to take the jab or not will ensure that many people will not be able to function in a post-covid world if there ever is one. How can they adapt when they have been damaged mentally? Who will have a will to rebuild a lost / destroyed career business?

[domino-710]

Another of your ' integrity ' filled morons.

Johnson's outspoken takes have run the gamut from vaccine skepticism to climate change denialism to downplaying the January 6 insurrection at the US Capitol. His evolution from a conservative businessman to two-term senator apparently willing to deny facts and spread conspiracies has left some in the state wondering: What happened to Ron Johnson?

He had a good grasp on reality 'and then Trump happened'

Mark Becker, the former head of the Brown County Republican Party, is one of a handful of Republicans in the state who have not only turned against former President Donald Trump but also against Johnson.

[rogespeed]

the process :  first a crisis of differing opinions that remains unresolved , then the universal ordered cold shoulder treatment , then the phone call , sorry no vax no involvement 

[twyngwyn]

why is the covid crisis different to any other pandemic? In order to come to Australia in the 60's we were REQUIRED to have certain jabs....now, you can't go near a baby for 6 weeks unless you have had Pertussis jab, just to mention the one...I'm sure that a lot of countries have differing requirements. You can either take a chance or live in a cocoon....that is what society has always done to advance....otherwise you become the 'other' and left behind.

I appreciate the 2 schools of thought on this, but have made up my mind, and respect others' choices...the best to all of us!

[countessalmirena]

WHO says Delta COVID-19 strain is still dominant globally and Omicron is not mild

While the infectious Omicron variant of COVID-19 appears to produce a less severe disease than the globally dominant Delta strain, it should not be categorised as "mild", World Health Organization officials have said.

"Just like previous variants, Omicron is hospitalising people and it's killing people," said WHO director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus at a Thursday media briefing from WHO headquarters in Geneva.

"In fact, the tsunami of cases is so huge and quick that it is overwhelming health systems around the world."

COVID-19 has killed more than 5.8 million people globally.

Dr Tedros said a record 9.5 million cases of the coronavirus were tallied around the world over the last week, "the highest number" reported so far in the pandemic.

Dr Tedros said the WHO was certain that was an underestimate because of a backlog in testing around the year-end holidays.

He repeated his call for greater equity globally in the distribution of and access to vaccines.

Based on the current rate of vaccine rollout, 109 countries will miss the WHO's target for 70 per cent of the world's population to be fully vaccinated by July, Dr Tedros added.

WHO adviser Bruce Aylward said 36 nations had not even reached 10 per cent vaccination cover. Among severe patients worldwide, 90 per cent were unvaccinated, he added.

The organisation's emergencies chief, Dr Michael Ryan, said speculation omicron might be the last variant of the outbreak was "wishful thinking" and cautioned there was still "a lot of energy in this virus".

'Variant of concern'

Janet Diaz, WHO lead on clinical management, said early studies showed there was a reduced risk of hospitalisation from the Omicron variant first identified in southern Africa and Hong Kong in November compared with Delta.

For several reasons — including rising vaccination rates in some places, and signs that omicron affects the nose and throat more than the lungs — omicron has not appeared as deadly as the delta variant that preceded it.

She did not give further details about the studies or the ages of the cases analysed, but the impact on the elderly is one of the big unanswered questions about the new variant as most of the cases studied so far have been in younger people.

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This is one point I want to stress. We still DO NOT KNOW just how deadly Omicron is. There are indeed signs that it's less deadly than Delta, but it's still too early to make definitive clarion calls about it. It's still resulting in deaths. I am awaiting further data, and I'll post it once the results are in.

[springyzone]

I saw this in a report yesterday. It was about researchers from several different countries and what they were saying. I will only quote part of it as it is very long.

Some experts have always maintained that the coronavirus would eventually morph into a seasonal cold-like virus as the world develops immunity through vaccines and natural infection. But the emergence of the highly-mutated Omicron variant appears to have sped the process up.

MailOnline analysis shows Covid killed one in 33 people who tested positive at the peak of the devastating second wave last January, compared to just one in 670 now. But experts believe the figure could be even lower because of Omicron. 

The case fatality rate — the proportion of confirmed infections that end in death — for seasonal influenza is 0.1, the equivalent of one in 1,000. 

Meanwhile, researchers at Washington University modelling the next stage of the pandemic expect Omicron to kill up to 99 per cent fewer people than Delta.

• Scientists know Omicron is more infectious than previous strains of Covid due to the speed it has taken off around the world.

The variant has also been linked with causing more reinfections that previous strains, which experts say is likely due to its extensive mutations

• The UK Health Security Agency (UKHSA) analysis of nearly 800 Omicron infectious found six per cent were reinfections, suggesting it is 5.5 times more likely to re-infect than Delta. 

And some experts say the period of the new variant - the time taken from infection to first symptoms - appears to be much shorter than other strains.

• Scientists in the UK said those infected with Omicron are 70 per cent less likely to be hospitalised, but experts in South Africa said the figure may be as high as 80 per cent.

However, it is unclear whether this is because the strain is inherently less severe or if protection from vaccines and prior infection mean people who catch Omicron are becoming less unwell.

'Huge numbers of infections and moderate numbers of hospitalizations may still translate into a peak of reported (global) daily deaths over 9,000 in early February.

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Just replying generally to the opening post. I do believe basic hygiene is something that people are more careful about these days and that's a good thing, but whether we need hand sanitiser as such once the worst of the pandemic is past, I am not so sure of. I did read a report that said we are just making some bacteria resistant to it. Maybe soap and water would be adequate in normal times.

I have been on cruises in the past and saw hand railings etc being wiped down on a regular basis. I actually think ships were ahead of the game as there was always hand sanitiser before meals too.

What probably needs to be looked at more in buildings, ships etc is air circulation.

I agree that the 'soldier on' mentality probably needed to be toned down, not everything in life can be 'instantly' fixed, but that was a mind set I think some people were getting into.

With regard to omicron, this is hardly a scientific observation but my anecdotal experience is this: It is everywhere (at least in Melb metro) and any figures you see are the tip of the iceberg.

People here cannot get a PCR test in a lot of cases, there are no RAT kits to be had, they are like gold.

I lead a quiet life but even I know of at least 10 people who have gone down with it.

The problem as I see it is people who once would have been classified as close contacts and have been told to isolate now just go about suiting themselves. They won't isolate unless they themselves get sick.

You'll get some who will do the right thing but I'd be pretty sure a lot are just going about life as normal with a selfish disregard for others.

That's what I am seeing. I know of an older couple whose son was diagnosed yesterday (RAT kit so not in official figures) who had dinner at their place Wednesday but they are now set up in a caravan park for their holidays, shared toilet/shower facilities etc and they have no intention of disrupting their holiday and also no way to take a rapid test to at least check if they are negative.

On a positive note, of all the people I know of who have had it, most have felt pretty sick for a day or so but no one has been even close to needing hospital. That isn't to say some people won't and that no one will die of it. We can only hope it is less deadly than delta. Most viruses do mutate, nothing stays the same forever so on the balance of probabilities, after 2 years we should be approaching that. 

Nothing to say there won't be other viruses or mandemics in our future though.

[springyzone]

By way of PS. Those coming down with omicron (the ones I know of) have just about all shown the first symptoms on day 3.

We can pretty much exactly gauge that because my sister and her family attended a Boxing Day function, which was a Sunday. On Monday they had word an uncle who had been there had taken a rapid test and showd as positive.

As close contacts they all went for PCR tests. The results did not come back till about 4 days later but before then, on the Wednesday, 3 of them were feeling ill. All later confirmed as positive cases.

[chameleon54]

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@domino-710 wrote:

What - no mention of an increase in valuation of your ' remote ' farm. 

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I dont visit the boards much these days ( other fish to fry ) but just noticed this little jibe. The answer is the remote farm has doubled in value in the last 18 months ( thanks for your interest ) with much of the increase coming in recent months.

The reason I bothered replying at all is the reason behind the jump is interesting. It is not driven by people leaving the cities in search of a better life as is the case with the near city farm. It is being driven by  COVID disruptions to global transport and COVID disruptions to farm inputs such as fertilisers and chemicals etc, all of which is leading to global food production disruptions and possible shortages. Prices for many farm commodities are at record levels ( if you can actually grow it with disrupted farm inputs ). 

The point is the COVID story has still got a long way to play out with the potential economic effects of government money printing, government spending on COVID supports, small business collapses, inflation resulting in rising interest rates and general shortages across the board lasting long after the virus recedes.

And yes I,m putting my money where my mouth is. The " FOR SALE " signs are about to go up on the near city farm after receiving an unsolicited seven figure + offer to buy from an interstate business person. Looking at current real estate markets, I dont think many in the general public have quite grasped the potential economic risks on the horizon.

" The money or the box ? " I,m taking the money on the near city farm,  clearing my debts, banking the rest and sitting back watching the action from the boundry. I suspect the potential chaos could throw up some opportunities for anyone with a bundle of cash to spend a bit later on.

[*sons_and_daughters*]

My husband had surgery 5.5 years ago to remove his voice box, that now makes him vulnerable and will more than likely die if he gets it, even being vaccinated.

Between winter 2016 and 2019, he would go to hospital in winter, with a stack of different respiratory illness, between 5 and 8 times each winter, usually closer to 8. He would usually spend 1-2 weeks in hospital each time. 

Since the Covid hit, we started using the sanitisers at the entrances to shops. We started using the trolley wipes. When we got back in the car, we'd sanitise. After packing the groceries, or whatever, away, we'd hand wash with soap and water. The results of this is, he's not been to hospital one single time since October 2019. Yes, he wears a face mask when out, but it's pointless, because he doesn't breathe through his nose and mouth.

So, even when this virus is done and dusted, we'll still continue those practices, because for us, it worked. You know things were bad, when everyone in the emergency department knew him by name. Same as the nurses on the ward. Maybe not seeing him for 2 years, they think he's dead!

As for my house, no, I don't sterilise the place, I don't use any antibacterial sprays or wipes (which are generally useless for a virus, but I digress). I clean (or not) as I always have. Germs in our home are ours. There is no reason to eradicate them, because they continue to boost our immune system.