How long has ebay been encouraging offers on listings without MAO enabled?

[brerrabbit585]

Has this been around for a while and I just haven't seen it because I haven't wanted to ask sellers a question?  I'm talking about the topic that relates specifically to make an offer.  

Maybe this is why I had a few offers last year.  I still think it's rude to ask if the seller hasn't invited it and people who ask will still get put on my blocked list.

I only found this because today I got an email with the subject "Make an offer: XXX (buyer ID) sent a message about XXX (item title)" and decided to have a bit of a look around.  The above example is from someone else's listing.

There's nothing on my listing that shows anything about offers so it was an unsolicited offer that was encouraged by ebay - but still not encouraged by me!  I think it's time to say "NO OFFERS!" in all my listings.  I don't want to block them from asking any questions at all because I actually find that gets me a few extra sales (on ebay).

[imastawka]

Springy, ebay has insidiously inserted 'make an offer' in the options

when you click on 'contact seller'

It's not in the listings, it only appears when you contact the seller to ask a question.

[lyndal1838]

Stawks, ebay is also inserting Make an Offer on auction listings.

I have been searching for some discontinued corningware and found some listed as an auction.  I really wanted to purchase immediately and was delighted when I saw Make an Offer.   It was only when I looked closer that I realised the seller did not have a Buy it Now price and I guessed ebay was behind it.    At no point did I even attempt to contact the seller.

I made an offer at the auction start price which was rejected which pretty much convinced me that the seller had nothing to do with the offer on the listing.

I ended up getting it with one bid.

It doesn't seem very fair to me to put a buyer on a blocked bidders list when/if they have simply followed the prompts on a listing.

Not everyone comes to the boards to know it is ebays doing and nothing to do with the seller.

[springyzone]

Yes, stawka, I gathered it was ebay tinkering. I probably should make it clear that I think ebay is totally in the wrong here. What ebay should write in that spot is something like-Make an offer is not available on this item. To buy, simply bid or buy it now at the advertised price.

But that is not what they do. For them to acknowledge that the seller has not enabled it but the buyer is still very welcome to try is cheeky, to put it politely.

The trouble though, as I see it, is exactly what lyndal said and also I think what DG was mentioning earlier. The understandings that it puts in place for a viewer.

Anyone seeing it is going to think (and probably correctly) that the ebay marketplace encourages buyers to make offers and that it is perfectly acceptable to try.

Now the same thing happens on Gumtree (only more so, as every item there has a box in the ad that says 'Make an offer") & the way that I as a seller have judged people on there is more along the lines of how polite they are about making an offer (even when I didn't say I was open to offers) and whether it is a sensible sort of offer. Half price or less is not acceptable, it is insulting.

On ebay I have always felt it is a bit different as you can tell on ebay if an ad is open to offers or not by the format, but I think ebay itself is muddying the waters here, so it may not actually be the fault of the buyer any more, they have been misled, is all I meant.

I think it would be a good thing actually if sellers always refused to accept any offer unless an ad is in the Make an offer format. Every time a seller does accept an offer when an ad didn't specify offers were welcome will just lead buyers to think this is the way to do it for the best price.

[joztamps]

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@imastawka wrote:

Springy, ebay has insidiously inserted 'make an offer' in the options

when you click on 'contact seller'

It's not in the listings, it only appears when you contact the seller to ask a question.

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It's also now in the Seller's options when he/she answers a question from the Buyer.

[brerrabbit585]

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@joztamps wrote:

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@imastawka wrote:

Springy, ebay has insidiously inserted 'make an offer' in the options

when you click on 'contact seller'

It's not in the listings, it only appears when you contact the seller to ask a question.

---

It's also now in the Seller's options when he/she answers a question from the Buyer.

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That's been there for a looooong time.

I don't care what ebay says in encouraging people to send offers - they've made it clear that the seller hasn't invited offers and anyone with half a brain should know that if the seller hasn't invited them then they don't want them, thus asking a person to sell for less is rude.  Ebay hasn't told them to make an offer, they've only encouraged or suggested it.  Buyers are still allowed to think for themselves and should still think for themselves.  If they think that offering 20% off the price is okay, they have to expect to take the consequences of it, which could be that the seller blocks them.

Gumtree has a bad reputation because of the rude offers and tyre kickers so it's stupid for ebay to encourage the same sort of behaviour on ebay.  The two sites work completely differently and attract different sorts of buyers and sellers.  Ebay isn't a Turkish bazaar (yet) but that's what they seem to want to turn it into.  They'll ruin it if it ends up like gumtree.

If I accept offers for 20% off my price, that reduces my profit by anything up to 60%), and my selling is my income.  Anyone who expects me to go without my profit is essentially asking me to go without food or some other basic necessity, but of course they don't think of it like that - they think everyone else has plenty of money and they're the only one who's important enough to have what they want, when they want it, and for what they think they should pay.  If they can't afford something (especially a luxury item) they should just not buy it, rather than expect the seller to give away their livelihood. 

Making an offer this way creates more work for the seller, but of course we all know ebay LOVES making more work for sellers.  As a seller, I have three options, only one of which involves no extra time/effort.  I either ignore the message altogether or I have to waste time sending a message saying no, or I have to alter the listing so they can buy at the reduced price, then I have to change the listing back again after they buy if I have more than one of it.  In the meantime someone else might buy from that listing at the reduced price, then others see in my feedback and sold items that I've sold at a reduced price so they also expect me to sell for less.  In the end everyone expects everything cheaper and cheaper.  I reduce my income to half what it was before and I can't survive on it so I stop selling and go back to Centrelink, and buyers have less choice of what to buy.  No, buyers don't think about any of this when they make an offer - they only think of themselves, and I'm not interested in dealing with greedy people!

[brerrabbit585]

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@imastawka wrote:

Springy, ebay has insidiously inserted 'make an offer' in the options

when you click on 'contact seller'

It's not in the listings, it only appears when you contact the seller to ask a question.

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And once a buyer knows it's there, they'll make offers to every Tom, Dick, Harry, Jill, Susan and Diana, and think they should never have to pay full price again.

And of course I advertised the fact that it's there in the questions by starting a thread about it.    

[lyndal1838]

I can see your point when a buyer uses the link to make an offer but do you still feel the same way when ebay has inserted "make an offer" on the listing when it is an auction with no BIN?

I am a regular boardie as you know but the whole thing threw me.  As soon as the seller rejected my offer of the auction start price I realised it was ebay's meddling, not just a mistake on the sellers part.

I think ebay's actions are disgraceful but I also think that blocking buyers because they use a function provided by ebay is a bit tough.

Now it appears that buyers need to message a seller to ask if they have added BIN/Offer to their listing or is it ebay's doing?

[countessalmirena]

lyndal, I would have to agree with you on the subject of eBay's inserted . It doesn't look to a buyer as though that's eBay's meddling. It would be impossible to determine from the bare bones of any listing whether the invitation to make an offer is with the seller's knowledge and agreement or whether it's in absolute defiance of the seller's intention.

brerrabbit, I can definitely see adequate reason for your wanting to block buyers who make an offer even though the listing doesn't include the button... where the buyer is even informed that the seller hasn't enabled offers. It's more eBay's fault than the buyer's fault, I think (because eBay says "See if they'll consider one" which is just ridiculous) - but it also shows worrying buyer behaviour. Perhaps in some cases the buyer is innocent or ignorant of how this strikes a seller; perhaps the buyer thinks that the seller must have forgotten to include the offer function, or would be grateful to receive some interest in the item. However, when I think of how I'd react if I read "See if they'll consider one", it truly strikes me as pushy and offensive.

❍  Details about item (3)

❍  Postage (8)

❍  Combined postage (1)

🔘  Make an offer (1)

❍  Pay for item (2)

❍  Returns (5)

❍  Other (4)

Make an offer: We found 1 answer(s)

How do I make an offer?

The seller hasn't enabled offers for this item. See if they'll consider one – send a message with your best price.

Yes... proceeding with making an offer in this sort of case would be something like seeing "No Trespassing: but don't worry about the sign; just go onto the land and see if the owner objects" in a little brochure next to the owner's NO TRESPASSING sign. What sort of rude rambler would actually do that?

The seller is increasingly deprived of means with which to filter out buyers who pose reasonably high to very high risk to their effective business model. It's a pity that sellers are now in the position of seemingly having to choose between buyers being able to ask a question before the purchase, or shutting down pre-purchase communications altogether (to avoid having to deal with unwanted offers). I can imagine that for large-scale sellers the number of unasked-for offers would be quite high, and as has been pointed out, that takes up time and resources, all of which cost money... to no purpose...

[Anonymous]

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@lyndal1838 wrote:

I can see your point when a buyer uses the link to make an offer but do you still feel the same way when ebay has inserted "make an offer" on the listing when it is an auction with no BIN?

I am a regular boardie as you know but the whole thing threw me.  As soon as the seller rejected my offer of the auction start price I realised it was ebay's meddling, not just a mistake on the sellers part.

I think ebay's actions are disgraceful but I also think that blocking buyers because they use a function provided by ebay is a bit tough.

Now it appears that buyers need to message a seller to ask if they have added BIN/Offer to their listing or is it ebay's doing?

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Making an offer when MAO is enabled on the listing (whether ebay added it or the seller) is a completely different thing to making an offer when you've explicitly been told by ebay that the seller hasn't enabled it on that listing.  Yes, they add afterwards to more or less go ahead and make an offer anyway, but if I knew that the seller hadn't enabled it I wouldn't expect them to welcome me with open arms if I did offer them less.  To say "they haven't enabled offers on this listing but make an offer anyway" is pretty much the same as saying, "They haven't enabled offers because they don't want them, but what the heck, you may as well give it a try - but it's your risk". 

If a buyer knows I've got it on none of my listings and they go ahead and make an offer anyway, they can hardly expect me to fall over myself to accept it.  Half the problem is that the forums are filled with sellers who make it clear they're desperate for a sale at any price and this makes buyers think we're all desperate enough to give them whatever they want.  I'll bet most of them wouldn't try the same on in a b&m shop, though some people would because they've got more front than Myers!

Ebay haven't provided a 'function' to make offers in the case of seeing that note in the FAQs.  Buyers are fully aware that the seller hasn't invited any offers.

If ebay puts it on a listing without the seller's permission, buyers have absolutely no way of knowing that, so unfortunately the relevant sellers need to deal with it the best way they can.  If it was me I think I'd be going to the ACCC first and then seeing who else might be able to help me.

[digital*ghost]

Just so people are aware, the little pane that pops up with "The seller hasn't enabled offers for this item. See if they'll consider one...." does not appear if the seller has not enabled FAQs via their site preferences (Manage communication with buyers), you just get the button to click through and ask a question, or make your offer.

I got a little excited when I was looking through my FAQs options and saw "Don't show to buyers", but after testing this option out and enabling the FAQs, all that does is keep the topic in the subject list, but doesn't allow an answer to be visible to it. 

However, I edited it again to show answers, added in my own Q&A, and this is what it looked like when I went to ask a question via another account (I've scrubbed out my username from the reply, but that shows there next to the answer):

I've disabled my FAQs again, as they currently include some very outdated info from when I last had them enabled, but thought people might like to know they can override eBay's "try anyway!" line. 

.