isnt australia post refunding on lost parcels anymore?

[miarose03]

Hi in 7 yrs i have only had to refund around 4 buyers with items not received. Australian post always used to send a money order out if they couldnt find it. I have had a lady buy some items that went into a large prepaid bag worth $60. I know its only covered to $50 but.... i have just received a letter today saying they wont refund as it was an ordinary article and they have 22 million items daily and its not possible to track it down??

So if this is so looks like we all need to register everything, im pretty shocked this time they wont refund when i personally handed it into the post office.

[punch*drunk]

thanks punch i think ill ask at my postal office and see if they are actually scanned if they go in the red boxes and ill do it that way so much easier.

There are some post offices that dont have scanning abilities and some that simply dont know they are required to scan them when they hand them over.

AP will tell you they should all get scanned, but the reality is that they dont. I check the tracking on my satchels regularly and about 1 in 7 of them never get scanned. Personally I see that as a small risk. I only average about 1 in 2000 items go missing so the chances of one without tracking going missing is more like 1 in 14000. If my items were at a higher risk of fraudulent claims, I would consider getting them all scanned.

[miarose03]

yes i agree if they are over $40 i would definately get them scanned but most of mine is like under $30 worth.
Sorry to bug you punch but... if i do a click and send and put it in a red box can i then use the number to track it myself where it is as i did see something on the weblink you print out the label which must have a number if you pay an extra $1?

[punch*drunk]

You can track them on the click and send website and also on the AP website. But, of course, they wont show until they get to a point of scanning. I will log into my account and see if I can get a screenshot of what you will see.

[punch*drunk]

This is the tracking for 2 items posted in the red box on Monday.





The second one hasn't been scanned anywhere, and as its going to NT, I would be very surprised if it did.

The first was wasn't scanned until the day it was delivered.

[lane-ends]

question still remains who pays out buyer if it disappears somewhere in the postal system after it has been scanned at the counter. AP? paypal? Reg post would involve AP insurance but click and send does not. so is the risk now put back on buyer and hence the onus to register. Has click and send nullified paypals buyer protection? Someone somewhere will be out of pocket for a disappearing parcel.

[straybooksoz]

question still remains who pays out buyer if it disappears somewhere in the postal system after it has been scanned at the counter. AP? paypal? Reg post would involve AP insurance but click and send does not. so is the risk now put back on buyer and hence the onus to register. Has click and send nullified paypals buyer protection? Someone somewhere will be out of pocket for a disappearing parcel.

C&S is a Paypal compliant postage method, as long as the item gets scanned at some point in it's journey.

So, just like registered, the buyer has Paypal protection (if they pay with PP) and so does the seller, up to $50.

If the item goes walkabout, I assume Paypal end up carrying the can.

[the3coopers]

question still remains who pays out buyer if it disappears somewhere in the postal system after it has been scanned at the counter. AP? paypal?

The buyer claims on Paypal, and Paypal refunds them.

If the seller can prove postage (eg tracking that is addressed to BUYERS ADDRESS) then Seller doesn't have to reimbuse Paypal. Paypal "insures" the loss.

Australia Post refunds nobody, unless the optional $1 is spent on Signature + Cover. In which case the Seller can make a claim on AP and gets a refund.

The situation is identical to how Registered Post works. What part is confusing?

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[the3coopers]

Has click and send nullified paypals buyer protection? Someone somewhere will be out of pocket for a disappearing parcel.

No, NOTHING nullifies Paypal Buyer Protection. Ultimately it is the seller who is responsible for delivery of the item.

HOWEVER - if the seller uses an approved postage method, then they get SELLER Protection. Don't confuse the Buyer and Seller Protection - they are completely separate things, and are not mutually exclusive.

Click and Send is a "approved postage method" for Seller Protection. But only because the item is "online trackable".

Registered is also an "approved postage method", but it qualities because it demonstrates "Proof of Shipment". It's not "online trackable" but instead the seller has written proof that they lodged the item with the carrier, AND that the carrier had "agreed" to deliver it to a certain address.

So, they are different things. Registered is "Prood Of Shipment", and Click and Send can show tracking.

But if you drop a C&S item in a red post box then there is a risk that it won't get scanned, or only get scanned on delivery. Now, if it's scanned on delivery then that is OK for Paypal Seller Protection, because it got scanned. But if it went "missing" before it got scanned, then there is no tracking, and thus there is no Paypal Seller Protection.

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[viewmont1071]

When Australia post change their terms and conditions is when they will stop refunding discretionary refunds

]But if it went "missing" before it got scanned, then there is no tracking, and thus there is no Paypal Seller Protection.

The click and send bags have the buyers name and address recorded with a unique transaction number AND MY PAYMENT

All modes of freight regardless of the NAME OF THE SERVICE REQUIRE
copy and paste of the minimum requirements
This documentation must include:

The delivery address of the buyer (as shown on the PayPal transaction details page)
The date the item was sent.
An official acceptance of the item by the shipping company, such as a postmark or online status update. A status showing the item was delivered is also acceptable.

The delivery address of the buyer is shown on the click and send site. My credit card payment shows official acceptance (receipt) and the date of the transaction.

If paypal would like to accuse me of any deception then they will need to prove that I did not post the article... well at least that is what the ombudsman will ask them to prove..... my receipt linked to the click and send information is my proof that's for the "you could then post the parcel anywhere or not post it at all" brigade. ( no good arguing with me argue with australia's legal system “burden of proof” and all that jazz)

Also acceptable to paypal is express post PARCEL ,CP72 and cp74

what is a receipt

A receipt is a written acknowledgment that a specified article or sum of money has been received as an exchange for goods or services. The receipt is evidence of purchase of the property or service obtained in the exchange

Anyways.... you make your own mind up

So the sequence of assumptions, and burdens of proof, goes something like this:

interesting piece from the link...when push comes to shove:|

A person going about their ordinary daily business is presumed innocent. They are not required to show that they are not committing a crime.

That a poster is explaining how a company would prefer you to act is sometimes not in line with the actual companies polices... or in fact your best interests.

[viewmont1071]

I guess the point I am making is this... There are not separate/special provisions for any paypal SPP accepted freight mode. ie tracking


If there were they would need to be included in the paypal help proof of shipment page...