How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

Hey there community!

Recently I have had 4 sellers who I have bought multiple items from in an order, but they did not sent all of the items. They marked all items as sent. They used tracking and now this says all items have been delivered but the packages did not contain all of the items that should be there.

One seller had listed the weights of the items that should have been in the order, and the combined weight of those items, plus the packaging was far more than the actual registered weight on the Australia Post label which to me should be enough proof that the items were never sent.

In one recent delivery the seller left 5 items out of an order of 30 items without letting me know there was a problem.

It is stressful and tedious to go through the process of having to open multiple return requests on a single order, and especially so if the items are marked as sent as the "Item Not received" as the Ebay automatic return option is not available and you have to go through customer service to open a request.

At first I wanted to give the sellers the benefit of the doubt, but since one has clearly admitted that they knew they could not fulfil the order but didn't contact me about it before fraudulently marking that they sent it, and one seller has done it for both of the 2 orders I have made from them so far, I don't think that I can assume that the sellers are making honest mistakes. I think that some sellers may be trying to avoid selling at a lower auction price than they hoped for, or trying to avoid a defect for having to cancel an order, or just trying to get away with not sending out stock.

So far I have, after a lot of time and hassle, received refunds for most of the items that I paid for but did not receive because they weren't sent out.

A few days ago I decided after a lot of thought to give 2 of the sellers neutral feedback about the items they did not send and after I posted it one of them has been messaging me claiming that I have made them lose their job.

I have also had sellers complain that I opened a return case to organise a refund but I think that I have to do it else I am not protected if they fail to either refund my money or send me the product I ordered. I have already had an experience where a seller had promised to do a part refund because an item they sent me had defects but they never followed through until I opened a return case, so I am less trusting now.

I would really like to know if you have had these sorts of experiences and how you have handled it. Do you think that a seller that marks items as sent that they never sent deserves neutral or negative feedback? Do you try to resolve problems with a seller via "Other" topic in Ebay messages or do you go straight to a Return request?

If you are a high volume seller, and your prices are not high, is it reasonable for your buyers to expect that some items that they ordered may not arrive and they will need to file return requests and that it balances out because your items are less expensive than other sellers?

I'd love to hear about your thoughts and experiences!



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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

@imperatrixi,

 

I always try to give a seller the opportunity to fix a problem before opening a claim/dispute. Mind you, I can count on one hand (literally) the number of problems I've had with buying on eBay...

 

I suppose it doesn't really matter whether one gives a seller the benefit of the doubt, or whether one thinks it's deliberate. The simple issue is that you should receive what you have purchased, and that if there's a problem with the item/s (including if there are missing items), assuming that the items haven't been stolen en route or after delivery, it's up to the seller to fix the problem caused by their own behaviour.

 

I would communicate politely with the seller, and see what sort of remedy the seller can offer. In the case of multiple items, I suppose a partial refund would be in order, or the seller re-sending the items they failed to send. I would note down the latest date on which I could open a claim in eBay's MBG, and give the seller up to that time to resolve the issue. If no resolution by, say, a week before the claim has to be made, I'd communicate with the seller again to let them know I am opening a claim by such-and-such a date or such-and-such a time. That might prompt the seller to issue the relevant partial refund. If the seller's despatched the "missing items", I would reassure the seller that once the items turn up, I'll close the case. These timeframes should give the seller plenty of time.

 

I certainly don't think that giving a seller neutral feedback would result in the seller losing their job. That sounds risible. If a seller has said they will send missing items, but fail to send those missing items, that's behaviour that I would consider deserves a negative.

 

Were I you, I'd simply delete every message sent by the seller who has been melodramatically messaging you about their neutral feedback.

 

 

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

I can really only answer this from the perspective of a seller - what I do know is that ebay's system is set up to punish sellers who receive an order for an item they can't supply (and this can happen for a variety of reasons, sometimes it's 100% the seller's fault, sometimes it's not), but this in turn leads some sellers to act in a manner where protecting themselves from eBay becomes the priority over advising the buyer and risking an immediate defect.To exemplify what I mean, if a seller contacts a buyer and cancels a transaction because they are out of stock, they get a defect that can affect their ability to sell. It also gives a bad impression to the buyer about the seller. If they mark the item as shipped, then wait for the buyer to open an INR request, they'll issue a refund, the buyer feels good about the seller because they don't blame them for a lost package and got a refund, and eBay doesn't give the seller a defect.

 

It's a bit different with missing items, of course, but some might be thinking if they keep up the pretense of it being purely unintentional, it will avoid more problems. 

 

I am not condoning these kinds of actions, by the way, I think if sellers make genuine mistakes it can handled in a way that does not cause more trouble and delay for the buyer, or put the seller at risk either. 

 

If sellers are intentionally leaving items they can supply out of the package, though, for whatever reason, I think the request route is the best way to go. You can always send a quick message or inquiry, gauge their response, and if you're still wary or don't get a satisfactory reply, it's reasonable to then advise them you feel this is the best way to move forward. (BTW, items missing from an order come under 'Not as Described', not 'Not received' - not received disputes delivery only, not as described disputes contents).  

 

I don't know if this will help at all in terms of how to approach sellers, but I frequently have multiple-item orders, and occasionally either make a mistake and an item is not included (unintentionally), or find that I can't supply what the buyer has ordered. (And no, I would never suggest it's normal or that it can be expected, at least not from a seller who is trying to do the right thing - I am always very embarassed when it does, and grateful to the few regular buyers who are very patient and understanding with me when it's happened more than once Smiley Embarassed ). 

 

In the first instance, if I have left out an item and the buyer actually wants the item, it is better for them to contact me directly via a message because then I can check my records, verify that it was left out, and send a replacement. If they open a request, the only option becomes a refund. I don't particularly like requests, but I accept they are a part of eBay and will not usually hold it against a buyer if they open one, particularly when the reasons are genuine. In some cases I have advised buyers to open requests as the simplest solution for us both. 

 

If I discover that I can't supply an item (this usally happens because I've miscounted stock levels, or find a flaw that was previously undetected), then how I handle it depends on whether there are other items in the order. If it's just the one item, I contact and explain, and provide a few alternative options, including choosing a different item up to 20% more in value, or a refund. If there are mutliple items, I supply what I can of the item quantity (usually I am able to include a partial amount of what they ordered of the item I can't supply in full), but I will also issue a full refund and explain why (eg I selll things in packs, so say they ordered 50pcs and I only have 25, I'll send 25 and refund for the full 50). 

 

I mention this because it's the kind of response I'd appreciate if I were the buyer in these kinds of circumstances, and in fact it's what I've experienced from other (non-eBay) sellers in similar circumstances, so I think it can provide a little insight into the way sellers respond when they have different priorities than their own interests.

 

You said you gave the neutrals a lot of thought, which I respect, and I think anyone who blames you for losing their job (if that even happened) over such neutrals is again not looking at the bigger picture, nor what actions caused you to be dissatisfied with the transactions in the first place. If there's a fly in a meal and the diner complains, you don't blame the diner for complaining, you blame the staff responsible for sending out a meal with a fly in it. 

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

Thank you for your considered reply, I do think that giving the seller a resolve-by date is a good idea. I think that I could definitely do that when I only have a few issues to resolve and not loads of purchases to chase up.

I am working on creating a better system to keep track of purchases and I guess I could create a way to remind myself to check a refund status.

And thank you for labelling the seller's messages about neutral feedback as melodramatic. I know that there are consequences to seller account from less than positive feedback but that it's more the negative feedback that has the ebay account impact, the neutral is more about potential buyers impressions. But as ebay has advised me, they hope buyers will use the feedback system as truthfully as possible to let other buyers know who which sellers that other buyers have found to be genuinely reliable and conscientious and who is a bit of a dodgy seller. That way the good sellers get the kudos they deserve and buyers have a better experience. Hopefully!

I have seen plenty of what looks to me like shill bidders and buyers who are falsely increasing some seller's feedback percentages and comments.

If the buyer culture is to leave fair and accurate feedback with each purchase then the feedback system will be a useful asset for us all. I do wonder if the penalties ebay imposes for lowered feedback is too harsh and so buyers, including myself, are too hesitant to leave less than a positive.
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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

You sound like a great seller to do business with!

I do try to consider the situation from the seller's perspective a lot before I have decided what action to take. I am yet to become an ebay seller so I don't really know what it's like.

However I imagine the seller's situation might be, I still believe that a culture of honest and transparent transactions must prevail. (I do imagine a bunch of hungry children in a shack suffering because of negative feedback, and/or a sweatshop factory run by an angry seller with a whip as the worst case scenario brought on by negative feedback!

As buyer I think it's reasonable to have the expectation that when I order an item and make payment that the seller will send me the item as described and if they are unable to do it that they will let me know and not just wait to see if I complain.

If I spent a lot of time tracking the item down, maybe going through the gaming process of the auction and then waiting a month for a delivery, it is a real let-down when nothing arrives and then there is the stress of having to go through the hoops for resolution.

I can totally understand that sometimes problems arise that are outside of the seller's control or intention.

But I think that in some cases it can be the result of drop-shipping practices. The sellers do not have the item, they may never have seen it in real life, they cannot check it and so they cannot really be certain of the quality of what they have sold or that the order was actually sent. I think these problems with drop-shipping are bordering on deliberate misrepresentation. These situation can cause real problems for buyers and it's not the buyers fault - it's definitely a result of seller's motivation to profit with minimal effort. It's not easy to imagine a solution but maybe there needs to be an additional descriptor in the item listing that indicates whether the item is actually currently in the seller's physical possession. I don't know if there is a way to verify that though.

And maybe there needs to be some middle ground for sellers who only occasionally have to cancel an order because of their inability to supply in order to encourage more accurate and timely communication about order problems.

I don't think that it's acceptable for a seller to withhold items that have been bought from them just because they have failed to make their desired profit margin. Clearly they need to ensure that they are charging enough in their asking price or their auction starting price or their reserve so that they can meet their costs. I have had 2 sellers ask to cancel an item because they claimed to have run out but I was able to see that they were still listing the same item but at a higher price. I think they were drop-shippers and the wholesaler had upped their price and they had failed to end their cheaper listing or increase the price. Ebay knows that there are sometimes 1000s of sellers selling the same item from the same wholesaler and offers a price comparison to buyers so buyers can find the drop-shipper with the lowest profit margin. I am not sure that this is an ideal situation for buyers, there is pricing competition but if they are not receiving quality items or not receiving items at all then drop-shipping is a fail for buyers.

I also think that sometimes sellers are unable to competently cope with the demands of running their ebay sales, and then there are the sellers that are more deliberately failing to follow through with sales or to list their items accurately.

I agree that using the Ebay return request system makes it much easier for me as a buyer to keep track of items that are not as described or not received and the resolution. I have bought a close to 1000 individual and unique items within a few months recently and the defect rate is not insignificant, so it's a lot to keep track of if I have to monitor messages and semi-identifiable refunds coming in to see when I can cross a problem transaction off the "naughty list".

I can only imagine that it would also make it easier for sellers to maintain their returns cases to use the formal ebay dispute system too, especially for sellers who do large amounts of trade, apart from the sting of the penalties they get from ebay triggered by buyers having opened the cases. I read in the ebay sellers information that sellers do not get penalised if they are able to resolve a dispute without ebay arbitration, but maybe that isn't entirely accurate and the mysterious algorithms do turn up the punish mode with each new return request/item not received. Ebay does love its secrets!

With your advice about which category to open a refund request, I'm not sure that it should be "item not as described" if the problem with a transaction is that an individual item purchased that has been marked sent and was tracked as delivered then is missing from the tracked parcel. To me that does seem like a case for "item not received". I guess that "delivered" is a description, is that your reasoning? Either way, if it is a tracked item and is recorded as delivered, Ebay removes the option for you to open a case for this reason "item not received" and you have to contact them for further assistance.

I think that every buyer and seller has a different mindset and culture about trading. Ebay is a grand experiment in creating a system where everyone is given a fair go but what each ebayer generally considers fair is not the easiest to gauge and to implement, support and encourage.

I can only hope that when I have given out negative or neutral feedback, which I think is less than 10% of the feedback I have given (not certain about that!), that it serves to give an indication to other buyers who might also experience a problem that they wonder whether it is a one off mistake, that the seller is no angel, and also lets the seller know that it is not something that they should make a habit of as it makes for unhappy buyers and has consequences.

I also try to imagine what my ethics and practices would be as a seller, and how I might respond to a buyer who has had a problem with a transaction with me. I definitely think that there are massive cultural differences in how people conduct trade and what they consider to be normal and acceptable business practice, but again we all have to meet somewhere in co-creating a workable Ebay culture for all users.

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

Looking at your feeedback left for others, the bottom line is, if you buy Chinese,

then you will continue to have problems.

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

I've been a seller, am mostly a buyer these days.

I know that mistakes can happen but by the sounds of it, some of your sellers are doing it deliberately, perhaps for some of the reasons digital ghost outlined.

I don't like it, for the simple reason that I suspect some of the sellers are hoping you won't notice or else hoping you won't go through with a claim because it is not as straight forward a process when we're talking about something labelled & tracked as sent.

 

This is a classic case where there isn't any evidence at all you can provide to absolutely prove things were missing (except in cases where you know exact weights and a package is well under).

 

If it happened to me, I would first of all contact the seller but I would be wanting a refund for those items not received. I would not be prepared to wait around for replacements unless you are talking of sales within Australia. In that case, if  seller offered to replace, I would accept but politely make it clear there was a deadline and what that deadline was.

If it didn't arrive by then, I would open a case.

 

Any seller who messages you, trying to lay guilt on you over their own shortcomings doesn't deserve an ounce of sympathy. If they had said they were sorry and had been rushed but would fix the situation, that's fine. But to tell you they are losing their job etc because of you is rubbish. If they did indeed lose any job it would be because of multiple errors or theft.

 

It's not reasonable for any seller to expect that because items are not expensive, that you, the buyer, should be prepared to only get part of what you ordered.

If a seller fixed a problem immediately for me, polite messages, prompt refund or replacement, and I suspected it was just human error, I would give them a positive feedback.

If they sent me messages promising replacement but none arrived in the time, and they tried to delay me further, I'd give a neg.

 

As regards your purchases. Did you mean you buy one item but it consists of a pack of several of whatever you are buying? Or did you mean you buy several separate purchases at the same time with the one seller?

If the latter, I'd be buying each one separately, unless you're getting some sort of postage discount. That way each one would have to have a separate tracking number.

 

 

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent


@imperatrixi wrote:
You sound like a great seller to do business with!


With your advice about which category to open a refund request, I'm not sure that it should be "item not as described" if the problem with a transaction is that an individual item purchased that has been marked sent and was tracked as delivered then is missing from the tracked parcel. To me that does seem like a case for "item not received". I guess that "delivered" is a description, is that your reasoning? Either way, if it is a tracked item and is recorded as delivered, Ebay removes the option for you to open a case for this reason "item not received" and you have to contact them for further assistance.




I guess I'm ok. Smiley Very Happy I'm sure I've had some buyers who would not think so, but for the most part I just try to do what is right. Other sellers can be motivated to do what has the least (immediate) consequence to their business - as a buyer I would be quite angry about such practices, as a seller I still think it's wrong, but can understand the thought process behind it, and that it's not purposefully malicious in many cases, but certainly a solution that is much less than ideal for buyers. (This obviously doesn't apply to sellers who do inentionally leave items out of orders, or refuse to send an item if the price acheived wasn't high enough, but Hanlon's razor can still apply - Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. In some cases it will be a scamming seller, so you can certainly attribute that to malice, but other times you've just got an imperfect person who handles things imperfectly and which impacts others negatively). 

 

With regards to the reason selected for disputes - I understand that when you don't receive something, an 'INR' dispute is the most intuitve reason to select as the reason for the dispute, but I said what I did in my previous post because that is not how eBay's (and PayPal's) system is set up. 

 

Item not received disputes quite literally work only on establishing postage (in the case of PayPal) or delivery (in the case of eBay). It doesn't dispute the contents of a package in any way whatsoever, so in a regular case if the buyer selects INR for a package where the seller can establish postage / delivery by PayPal's / eBay's rules, the seller will win pretty much 100% of the time.

 

They have specific options under not as described for packages that are missing contents. You sometimes have to jump through a few extra hoops to establish that the package didn't contain all items, but the seller can't simply turn around with just the tracking number to prove delivery of the items in question (this is one of the reasons I photograph the contents of all packages I send out, it enables me to immediately verify or disprove claims of items missing, the latter of which I have to do regularly, as well, unfortunately). 

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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

A lot of my dealings with Chinese sellers have been problem free and some Chinese sellers have treated me with every courtesy and exceeded my expectations. Let's face it, a huge proportion of whatever anyone is selling on Ebay has come from China so even if you personally aren't buying directly from a Chinese seller then someone else has for it to get to you. And in my experience I have had worse times generally dealing with sellers not in in China but another country, but again it hasn't been every seller from that country that has been problematic.

I do think that Ebay has done a lot to try and make trading a good and safe experience with their systems of checks and balances so that scammers get stopped. But it takes a good understanding of how to use the system properly, and making the effort to do it. I'm still learning how to navigate it.

I want to transact with Chinese sellers, there's too much opportunity to miss! I still think that there is a method to buy want I want without getting burned, generally.
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How to deal with a seller who does not send all the items in the order but marks them as sent

โNever attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.โž โ€“ digital*ghost

 

Exactly. It could be extended by adding "or mischance".

 

If we assume good faith on the part of others, it has several benefits:

 

   ๐Ÿ™ default state of mind is calmer than one who assumes malice, hence less likely to be swift to anger;

   ๐Ÿ™ stress level is lower;

   ๐Ÿ™ associated health benefits with lower stress levels;

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely to engage in a solution-based communication rather than choler-expressing communication;

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely to get a positive result;

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely to have friends;

   ๐Ÿ™ less likely to go Total Bรถdvar Bjarki;

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely to avoid family violence;

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely not to commit assault; and

   ๐Ÿ™ more likely to be greeted with a cheery smile rather than a brandished rolling pin.

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