**AUTISM / ASPERGERS SUPPORT GROUP**

[doll*obsession]

A safe place for all members with friends or family with ASD

Come and have a cuppa, share your joys, and vent your problems with other people who understand.

[aphroditebathandbody]

My son washes hands excessively with liquid soap but doesnt nesessarily have to be hot water. He is aspie no ocd at all. 🙂

[sheepy_1-4]

yep what Lisa said *nods*

depends what you mean by excessive though. If it is ASD, more than likely the result of an "obsession" rather than a "compulsion".

[azureline**]

excessive, hmm...last 3 days, maybe hourly?

[islandretro]

pnp - excessive handwashing can definitely be a part of OCD, and OCD can definitely be comorbid with ASD.

The difference needs to be teased out by a psych- OCD results from obsessive thoughts leading to compulsive behaviours. My 17 yr old with Aspergers was diagnosed with comorbid OCD when he was 11. He also handwashes, only with cold water and liquid soap, though he will use a cake of soap if nothing else is available.

Most rituals/stimming behaviours associated with ASD are less complex than handwashing, but it can be a stim. I am not sure that handwashing could be classed as an obsessive interest, but again, anything is possible

If she is handwashing because she is worried her hands are dirty, you need to have OCD considered, otherwise try distracting her. If she starts to conceal what she is doing - then she needs to be assessed for OCD.

cheers
Rae

[kire52]

Well hi everyone I just saw this group. I am going to explain my situation and hope someone can help me (Its a long story)
Until few months ago we were told our almost 8 year old has Autism after all the tests were completed it turns out he does not have it. In fact he is not fitting any of the similar syndromes.
In a way it was a relive but in another way it opens a lot of questions. His old school was not happy at all because they wanted the funding for his Aid but they told me he was only going to have the aid for few hours a week and the aid will be helping other kids as well.
They hoped he had intellectual disability as that's the way they can get money fast. When he was been tested (in the classroom with other kids in there) he was interrupted many times which was written in the report he got IQ 86-89 but it was suggested to me to repeat the test as it wasn't done properly because of where it was held and all the disruptions. (I feel like it was done on purpose to sabotage his results and get lower score).
Anyway after all tests were done and it turned out he is not autistic the school stopped almost all his extra help or should I say he was ignored.
Now he is very bright boy, interested in everything and wants to know more. He is gentle and has great manners and very friendly. He makes friends wherever we go. He has a speech delay (but slowly catching up).
NOW we moved 6 weeks ago so he changed schools. Yesterday (2 day at school) I spoke to his teacher and she was very unhappy about his behaviour. I personally don't think she knows how to handle kids with special needs. (school was told about his problem).
The kids were playing a game and he didn't want to play. (when he does not understand something he likes to watch what others do and once he knows he joins in no drama just let him watch for 2 min) so when he wanted to join she told him no because he didn't want to play before. So he got upset and she told him to go to the office (he has no idea where the office is or what's going to happen there) so he refused NOW the teacher physically removed him from class. She said he became violent. Now in all his life I have never ever seen my son be violent. So I am thinking she is overreacting or she pushed his button too far (I mean how far can that be when I have never seen that side ???)
I have an appointment tomorrow at school with god knows who. What should I address with them and what should I be asking for. It is obvious he needs help and there is something not right only we don't have a name for it. When he is supervised or helped he does great (oh and he still cant read he can spell by looking at the words but cant put it into words).

[superscanner4]

Hi kire52. It sounds as though your son fits in the group of PDD-NOS (Pervasive Developmental Disorder Not Otherwise Specified). These kids have developmental delays in language and social skills and some autistic traits but not enough to take them over the line into a diagnosis of an autism spectrum disorder. Did the school carry out the tests or did you go to an experienced clinical psychologist? You may want to pursue further testing in better controlled conditions. If your son still does not meet the DX criteria for autism or Asperger's, you will still need some help and the autistic associations can probably help you as there are parents out there who are trying to deal with the problem of lack of funding for people who do not meet the diagnostic criteria of autism but still have similar problems.

I'm sure there will be someone here on this forum with children in the PDD-NOS group who may have some advice.

[kire52]

The school did some assessments thru some company that they paid but that was for intellectually disability. He has been tested by various other specialist over the years last year we spend over $2000 on testing we also did the specific test for Autism and that's how we got the final answer that he didn't have Autism. That test was where the specialist had a session with us and then 3 of them had a session with my son.

[bella_again]

Kire if the teacher physically removed him it is quite likely he has reacted to that. If he is overwhelmed sensory wise and has no idea of the lay out of the school or is confused of course its possible he may have gone into meltdown mode.

Sounds to me like they need to make some considerations for him. Have they set some learning goals/strategies? A map of the school? A buddy for in the playground etc?.

If you have considered pursuing the questions you have over diagnosis, have you considered reconsulting a developmental Pead and looking at genetic testing?Genetic testing can be quite helpful in eliminating what could be going on and helping to answer some of those unanswered questions.

Can your son relay what happened at school to stress him out? All you can do is listen to the school and hear what they have to say.

Hopefully they will work with you to find strategies to deal with any behavior that might come up.

Good luck Kire 🙂

[sheepy_1-4]

kire, Bella made a very good point. (well a few actually, but I will just comment on the peady one) You need to find a peadiatrician that you like and trust. This way there is one person collecting all of the information and correllating it and comparing it and he gets the full picture - not just snippets from a 2 hour "test".

You might like to ask the peady how he feels about an IQ test done by a trained psychologist (more than likely a WIISK - I think he is too old for a wiipsy but I could be wrong)

I am not a doctor or anything remotely similar, but your son's 'symptoms" made me think of a speech and language disorder. Has anyone checked for that? Might be worth at least asking about. Maybe something to do with audio processing even???

I don't know - my friend has a son with the speech and language impairment and your son sounded just like him to me from what you have described.

Do you know what the diagnostic criteria is for autism or ASD or PDD? In your opinion, does your son meet any of these criteria? This could be a place to start at least - you know which traits to watch for and can ask the peady about them if you think they are a concern.

[kire52]

My son can tell me what happened and how he feels so I know why he reacted the way he did. As he wants to learn and make sure he knows what e does before he tries something he wanted to do that, but the teacher (having been with him for 1 day) decided that he was playing up or something. So when he went to join the game she told him "NO" as "you chose not to play" and he told her he wanted to play now. She then physically removed him and told him to go to the office to which again he said no (because he didn't know where that was and what's going to happen to him) then the teacher and another helper removed him out of the class.
Now to the other point.
The only things that bother him is thunder and loud music but if he is destructed or feels safe he is ok.
We had a pediatrician that I am no longer happy to see as he basically told me my son had no right to go to "normal school" or expect any help. As normal school is for normal kids. But the last time we saw him he said that my son does not have Autism.
When he was younger it did look like he had it, but as he is getting older he is loosing all those "symptoms". He has no problem socially, he has no problem with emotions (judging others emotions and his), he hates order and is absolutely not bothered about changes. He never lined toys or made repetitive movements or sounds. He has a great imagination and can pretend play. He looks people in the eyes (except when he is in trouble or shy).
When he went to 4 year old kindy he started coping some of the kids (he was in a group where half the kids had disabilities) and started to flap his hands and things like that but that went away when he finished kindy.
His major problem is concentration and with that come other things. Like if he missed part of the instruction and is confused then he decides to do it his way but if you can get him to pay attention then he is ok. We do cross word puzzles together (take 5 and that's life) and I am surprised how well he does. His long term memory is great but short not so much (but then again I am the same)
Hope I can get somewhere tomorow with the school but my lord I know I am going to cry my eyes out (its not helping that I am having another baby really soon my emotions are all over)