People who do not vaccinate will lose $

[***super_nova***]

From January 2016 parents who do not vaccinate their kids will lose up to $15 000 in allowances/concessions, except in cases of medical  and some religious reasons. 

[polksaladallie]

My research would be to ask a doctor, or 2 doctors, or 20 doctors, or 50 doctors, and take notice of the majority opinion.

[punch*drunk]

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@polksaladallie wrote:

My research would be to ask a doctor, or 2 doctors, or 20 doctors, or 50 doctors, and take notice of the majority opinion.

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Unfortunately some people arent that smart.

[gleee58]

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@amber-eyed-girl wrote:
Yes. I know a little of the history. Was wondering if you meant it had been used here, purposefully, to try to end lives. That I do not know about, you see.

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Yes, there are historical reports that small pox was spread deliberately north of Sydney. 

[raptor_rebooted]

Should be -  no jab, no pay IF you are a parent in receipt of FTB (A?) and/or childcare supplement.. but thats more than 3 words isn't it?

It actually means:

Parents who fail to immunise their children will no longer be paid the $200-a-week childcare benefit, the $7500-a-year childcare rebate or the $726 Family Tax Benefit A annual supplement.

[raptor_rebooted]

re exemptions on religious grounds:

Social Services Minister Scott Morrison said existing exemptions on medical and religious grounds would continue but a religious exemption would only be available when a religious group's governing body had formally registered its objection - and the Government had accepted it.

"There are no mainstream religions that have such objections registered," Mr Morrison said. "So, this would apply to a very, very, very small proportion of people - it'd be lucky to be in the thousands, if that."

[raptor_rebooted]

a good article  (imo)  from 2013

Unvaccinated children should be held back from school and groups spreading anti-vaccination messages should be punished, according to the federal president of the Australian Medical Association.

Dr Steve Hambleton said a report released on Thursday detailing national immunisation rates raised concerns about parents in certain areas not following vaccination guidelines.

''We should certainly make it difficult for [unvaccinated] children to get to school,'' said Steve Hambleton, responding to new national statistics on immunisation rates.

''And we should certainly have plans available to send all those children home if there are outbreaks.''

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/no-vaccine-no-school-says-ama-chief-20130411-2...

[k0llectable5]

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@gleee58 wrote:

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@secondhand-wonderland wrote:

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@gleee58 wrote:

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@secondhand-wonderland wrote:

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How can a child who is not carrying a disease spread a disease? When it is a well known fact that the recently vaccinated will actually shed the disease they have been vaccinated against for up to two weeks after vaccination. Childhood diseases are not back with a vengeance.  Where do you get your information? 

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Where do you get your information?

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Alot of different sources actually. Off the top of my head,  one major one who comes with a whole heap more is Dr Suzanne Humphries.  She has hours of lectures posted onto YT for anyone interested.  The Cochrane Collaboration, Dr Richard Blaylock, CDC, WHO, Disolving Illusions dot com, sane vax dot com, Vaers, medical, peadiatric, immunology and epidemiology journals.

And yours?

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I'm not the one who said children shed disease for weeks after vaccination.  And no, I don't believe that any scientist has said that vaccination causes the spread of disease for weeks after vaccination.

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Well according to several different Drs and Scientists I have seen speak, a person will shed (especially if live virus has been used in the vaccine) for up to two weeks.  

According to all the sources I have mentioned it is quite common to have reactions to vaccines that are very similar to the disease being vaccinated against.  There are many cases of people contracting measles after the MMR, vaccine strain polio, flu like symptoms following H1N1.  There is no question that these people are therefore contagious.  

Australia currently has no vaccine compensation court currently in place,  but America does.  They have paid out over 2 billion dollars in compensation relating to vaccine damage since its inception in the 80's. (appoximately one third of all trials) And amazingly enough 84 of these cases are autism related vaccine damage cases...

The biggest manufacturer in America Merck is currently involved in a massive court case involving two whislteblowers exposing fraudulant studies relating to MMR and autism.  The supreme court recently denied all attempts from Merck to have the case thrown out of court. (Interesting to note, not 1 mainstream media outlet has covered this story) 

Another interesting point I'd like to just add.  Also according to the sources I mentioned Doctors are not taught all that much about vaccines at university.  They are not taught about how they are made, they do very little on immunology but what they do get taught for 2 semesters is how to prescribe pharmaceuticals,  So if the average doctor doesn't keep track of all the latest info from medical journals and peer reviewed papers (and lets face it how many doctors out there have to the time to spend 2 or 3 hours a day researching about vaccines and immunology?) They give what is "reccommended" to them.  I'm not saying I know more than a Doctor (If I say I'd done 80 hours research on the topic, that would be a conservative guess)  what I am saying though is this whole debate screams to me of Argumentum ad populum (If many believe so, then it is so) 

Science always corrects itself (hence why many vaccines (and other drugs) have been recalled over the years.  These big Parma companies are paying out millions in compensation on a continual basis.  So why every time the vaccine debate comes up, people seem to exempt vaccines from scrutinization? When it has been proven time and time again that there is no real proof of the safety and efficacy of vaccines.  It has NEVER just been the vaccines that eradicated infectious diseases.  There are so many contributing factors that show most, if not all of these diseases were on the decline before the introduction of vaccines.  That infectious disease outbreaks occur all the time regardless of the vax status of the population.  And the absolute clicher imo;

Why are there NO short or long term double blind placebo studies being undertaken involving vaccine trials, it's only ever healthy people that are included in the studies, it's usually (but not always) hepatitis B vaccine used as the placebo, and as soon as any subject experiences an adverse reaction, they are immediately excluded from the mostly short term studies... Studies never include pregnant women, the elderly or babies under 6 months. So unfortunately this is the reality of the "scientific studies" so often quoted in the mainstream media, that are proving without a shadow of a doubt that vaccines are safe and effective.

[raptor_rebooted · Accepted solution]

There are many cases of people contracting measles after the MMR, vaccine strain polio, flu like symptoms following H1N1.  There is no question that these people are therefore contagious.  

Fortunately, vaccine shedding is not usually a problem because:

• most vaccines are not live and don't shed, including DTaP, Tdap, flu shots, Hib, hepatitis A and B, Prevnar, IPV, and the HPV and Meningococcal vaccines
• the oral polio vaccine is no longer used in the United States and many other countries where polio has been brought under control
• the MMR vaccine doesn't cause shedding, except that the rubella part of the vaccine may rarely shed into breastmilk (since rubella is typically a mild infection in children, this isn't a reason to not be vaccinated if you are breastfeeding though). What about the rare case of a person developing measles after getting the MMR vaccine? In addition to being extremely rare, it would also be extremely rare for a person to transmit the vaccine virus to another person after developing measles in this way.
• the chicken pox vaccine doesn't cause shedding unless your child very rarely develops a vesicular rash after getting vaccinated. However, the risk is thought to be minimal and the CDC reports only 5 cases of transmission of varicella vaccine virus after immunization among over 55 million doses of vaccine. 
• the rotavirus vaccine only causes shedding in stool, so can be avoided with routine hygiene techniques, such as good hand washing, and if immunocompromised peopleavoid diaper changes, etc., for at least a week after a child gets a rotavirus vaccine
• transmission of the live, nasal spray flu vaccine has not been found in several settings, including people with HIV infection, children getting chemotherapy, and immunocompromised people in health-care settings

And of course, children shed viruses and are truly contagious if they aren't vaccinated and naturally develop any of these vaccine preventable diseases.

http://pediatrics.about.com/od/immunizations/a/live-vaccines.htm

oral polio vaccine is no longer used

in australia either.

[***super_nova***]

Small pox has been eradicated by vccinations and we do not need to vaccinate against it any more.  Few years ago Polio was almost gone, mainly isolated to few places in Africa and Pakistan (?) and it was expected that we may be able to stop vaccinating against it within few years.  Then people stopped vaccinating and now there are suspected cases of polio in the USA where previously there were none since 1979.  It is only matter of time before there will be more as the immunisation levels keep dropping.  Just because tiny minority of people does not develop immunity when vaccinated, does not mean that vaccination is not effective.  

Herd immunity:

When a high percentage of the population is vaccinated, it is difficult for infectious diseases to spread because there are not many people who can be infected. For example, if someone with measles is surrounded by people who are vaccinated against measles, the disease cannot easily be passed on to anyone, and it will quickly disappear again. This is called ‘herd immunity’, and it gives protection to vulnerable people such as newborn babies, elderly people and those who are too sick to be vaccinated.

Herd immunity does not protect against all vaccine-preventable diseases. The best example of this is tetanus, which is caught from bacteria in the environment, not from other people who have the disease. No matter how many people around you are vaccinated against tetanus, it will not protect you from tetanus.

How does Herd Immunity work?

Herd immunity only works if most people in the population are vaccinated (for example, 19 out of every 20 people need to be vaccinated against measles to protect people who are not vaccinated). If majority of people are not vaccinated, herd immunity is not guaranteed to protect them.

[k0llectable5]

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

There are many cases of people contracting measles after the MMR, vaccine strain polio, flu like symptoms following H1N1.  There is no question that these people are therefore contagious.  

Fortunately, vaccine shedding is not usually a problem because:

• most vaccines are not live and don't shed, including DTaP, Tdap, flu shots, Hib, hepatitis A and B, Prevnar, IPV, and the HPV and Meningococcal vaccines
• the oral polio vaccine is no longer used in the United States and many other countries where polio has been brought under control
• the MMR vaccine doesn't cause shedding, except that the rubella part of the vaccine may rarely shed into breastmilk (since rubella is typically a mild infection in children, this isn't a reason to not be vaccinated if you are breastfeeding though). What about the rare case of a person developing measles after getting the MMR vaccine? In addition to being extremely rare, it would also be extremely rare for a person to transmit the vaccine virus to another person after developing measles in this way.
• the chicken pox vaccine doesn't cause shedding unless your child very rarely develops a vesicular rash after getting vaccinated. However, the risk is thought to be minimal and the CDC reports only 5 cases of transmission of varicella vaccine virus after immunization among over 55 million doses of vaccine. 
• the rotavirus vaccine only causes shedding in stool, so can be avoided with routine hygiene techniques, such as good hand washing, and if immunocompromised peopleavoid diaper changes, etc., for at least a week after a child gets a rotavirus vaccine
• transmission of the live, nasal spray flu vaccine has not been found in several settings, including people with HIV infection, children getting chemotherapy, and immunocompromised people in health-care settings

And of course, children shed viruses and are truly contagious if they aren't vaccinated and naturally develop any of these vaccine preventable diseases.

http://pediatrics.about.com/od/immunizations/a/live-vaccines.htm

oral polio vaccine is no longer used

in australia either.

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Not usually a problem, because most vaccines...) But it has and can happen. (Even if some sources say it's extremely rare and others say it's quite common.)   It's perplexing to me how people can be so sure of concepts like herd immunity (when the majority of adults aren't vaccinated) and of the certainty that vaccines immunize. When no one ever gets tested after they've been vaccinated to see if it has been effective in promping an immune response, and in the event of an outbreak just as many vaxxed as unvaxxed present in the emergency room.   

Scientists and doctors do know however that by using vaccines to induce immunization in people we are infact trying to cheat nature. We are using adjuvants to prompt our immune systems to react in a way that produces antibodies against the virus that is being vaccinated against. And according to science, if these antibodies have been produced (in an lab rat or monkey or petrie dish) then the vaccination has done it's job. And sometimes fast tracked onto the market before knowing what the effects of the vaccine will be on a human population. And there are no ways of knowing the long term effects of a; the 414% increase in the vaccination schedule for children under 6 and b; the long term effects of such an invasive vaccination schedule.