Senate inquiry into Halal certification.

[daydream**believer]

Brilliant.

Whether people support halal certification or not, there are lots of people with lots of concerns so its time to investigate it all.

http://www.3aw.com.au/news/bernardis-inquiry-into-food-certification-schemes-20150514-gh1c32.html

Here are the reasons i am against halal certification and the questions i want answered.
1. Why are the fees paid by businesses for halal certification kept secret? Why do the businesss have to sign non disclosure agreements?

2. Why are there 20+ privately run halal certification companies in Australia, all charging whatever amounts they want, when Indonesia only has 1 Government run halal certifier? If foods need to be halal certified, then let the Government run it and let the money go back into the whole Australian community.

3. For meat to be halal, the animal needs to be slaughtered a certain way, throat slit while animal is conscious by a Muslim. Yes, there are some abattoirs that use a reverse stun but, from what i have researched, there are at least 15 abattoirs in Australia that slaughter animals using no stun. It is barbaric. This video is very graphic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAQJ-FZo1cA

4. Australia is a predominantly Christian country, so why are we being forced to eat meat that has been prayed over to a "god" that we dont even recognise?

5. If halal certification is supposed to help Muslims recognise what they can and cant eat, then why do so many companies that pay for the certification stamp choose not to display it on their products?

6. Why are abattoirs paying a certification fee and then packing all the meat in one truck and delivering it to butchers and supermarkets who then put it all in the one fridge and display it all in the one display fridge. Once pork products are shelved, stored or transported with other meats, the other meats immediately become non halal anyway. So Aussie Muslims cant eat it anyway.

7. We are told halal certification monies goes towards to building of more mosques and Islamic schools. We know that there are quite a few mosques where the hatred of Australia is preached. As for Islamic schools, the same schools where a principal has said that girls are forbidden to run in races because it will cause them to lose their virginity. Do we need schools like that here?

8. In Canada halal certification money was found to be used to fund organisations linked to extremist organisations. I have no doubt that would be happening here as well.

9. Halal is a part of sharia law and we DO NOT want any part of Sharia law in Australia.

So, what would i like to see? Id like halal certification to be a Government run organisation. Id like every business who pays for halal certification to have to display the stamp on their products. I want all Australian abattoirs to stun before killing. That would be a nice start

[azureline**]

I am not here to try to change your opinion..........

This thread subject is about the inquiry.

[wayward216]

actually my first post was to you to expand on the difference between halal and kosher, a conversation you started. Had people not asked me to prove my claims the conversation would have stopped there.
As for you changing my opinion, given I haven't actually shared my opinion with you other than to express that certification of tourism is nonsense, I'm not sure what it is you don't want to change.

As for this thread, sorry there doesn't appear to be a lot of knowledge involved, more general assumptions. Hopefully you guys have been able to catch up a bit from where you were a week ago

http://halaltradegateway.com/halal-academy/halal-how-to-guide-2/halal-certification-and-accreditatio...

[azureline**]

The difference between Halal and Kosher??

yes, Halal = Muslim

Kosher = Jewish.....

I am sure everyone knows that.

You put forward something with nothing to back it up............. that is an opinion /assumption, not a fact.

[icyfroth]

---

@azureline** wrote:

The difference between Halal and Kosher??

yes, Halal = Muslim

Kosher = Jewish.....

I am sure everyone knows that.

You put forward something with nothing to back it up............. that is an opinion /assumption, not a fact.

---

There are actually a lot of similarites between Halal and Kosher.

[i-need-a-martini]

---

@wayward216 wrote:

I need a martini, sorry am I biased or were you describing yourself? I'm an Atheist, not sure about biased but feel free to prove you're not biased against Atheism or Sikhism beliefs? I suspect you can't.

Crescent do certify entire hotels, it is their highest level of certification.

Criteria:
1: Only Halal food on the entire premises (which excludes the sale of alcohol)
2: All of the following - Prayer facility, list of local mosques, knowledge of prayer times and directions, prayer mats or prayer tables, Qiblah marked in rooms (locater for Mecca)
3: Additional Ramadan specic requirements - transport to and from local Mosques, meals for Suhoor and Ifthar.
4: Does not offer any nightclubs or casinos, no adult television, seperate saunas, pool and gym fascilities  for men and women.

In order to be certified not only does the Hotel need to provide this, but they also need to pay annual certification and audit fees.

'rolls eyes'

---

Accreditation is not certification. 

Stars for facilities and quality of hotel? Thats accreditation, not certification.

Stars for quality of restaurants? Thats accreditation, not certification.

Stars for quality of halal facilities? Thats acceditation, not certification.

When you travel, you might reference Lonely Planet who rate tourism venues based on criteria that suit the Lonely Planet market.

Or perhaps you are a more cultured traveller? In this case you would reference Frommers who rate tourism venues based on their market.

Or when you choose a restaurant, you might reference the Michelin book who rate restaurants based on criteria.

If you were Muslim, you might reference this website because it will rate the tourism venues you might like to visit with criteria you would like when travelling.

Don't make it sound as if it is something sinister that is only exclusively available to a 'certain' few. The rating is no different to any other group rating their criteria to market products and services to a specific audience.

It is certainly no different to this:  http://atlantisevents.com/

Ie - selecting a holiday based on your personal preferences.

[i-need-a-martini]

---

@icyfroth wrote:

---

@azureline** wrote:

The difference between Halal and Kosher??

yes, Halal = Muslim

Kosher = Jewish.....

I am sure everyone knows that.

You put forward something with nothing to back it up............. that is an opinion /assumption, not a fact.

---

There are actually a lot of similarites between Halal and Kosher.

---

Except that meat is not kosher if the animal has been stunned prior to slaughter. I will repeat, the animal needs to be slaughtered alive. No stunning.

But a stunned slaughter is permissable in Islam halal and very little halal meat falls outside of this.

Therefore there is a big difference in regards to humane treatment of animals.

[wayward216]

Accreditation is not certification, since when?

Accreditation is a form of certification

If you seriously are going to try and backpedal over accreditation versus certification, when the actions are identical, then you're well and truly lost.
"

1. Certification refers to the confirmation of certain characteristics of an object, person, or organization. This confirmation is often, but not always, provided by some form of external review, education, assessment, or audit. Accreditation is a specific organization's process of certification.

[wayward216]

well if Thomson Reuters references along with Dubai' halal trade gateway, halalywood production company and a Muslim journalist in Malaysia aren't good enough for you. then there's not much more I can offer you I'm afraid. I guess you'll just have to continue believing that halal certification only applies to food.

http://www.tmfb.net/our-services

[icyfroth]

---

@i-need-a-martini wrote:

---

@icyfroth wrote:

---

@azureline** wrote:

The difference between Halal and Kosher??

yes, Halal = Muslim

Kosher = Jewish.....

I am sure everyone knows that.

You put forward something with nothing to back it up............. that is an opinion /assumption, not a fact.

---

There are actually a lot of similarites between Halal and Kosher.

---

Except that meat is not kosher if the animal has been stunned prior to slaughter. I will repeat, the animal needs to be slaughtered alive. No stunning.

But a stunned slaughter is permissable in Islam halal and very little halal meat falls outside of this.

Well seeing this is how most meat in Australia is slaughtered,  why the need for Halal certification?

Therefore there is a big difference in regards to humane treatment of animals.

---

[i-need-a-martini]

---

@icyfroth wrote:

---

@i-need-a-martini wrote:

---

@icyfroth wrote:

---

@azureline** wrote:

The difference between Halal and Kosher??

yes, Halal = Muslim

Kosher = Jewish.....

I am sure everyone knows that.

You put forward something with nothing to back it up............. that is an opinion /assumption, not a fact.

---

There are actually a lot of similarites between Halal and Kosher.

---

Except that meat is not kosher if the animal has been stunned prior to slaughter. I will repeat, the animal needs to be slaughtered alive. No stunning.

But a stunned slaughter is permissable in Islam halal and very little halal meat falls outside of this.

Well seeing this is how most meat in Australia is slaughtered,  why the need for Halal certification?

Therefore there is a big difference in regards to humane treatment of animals.

---

---

Halal animals need to be killed instantly, need to be bled out quickly and the spinal cord can't be touched.

In most abbotoirs, stunned animals can hang around half dead until they get to where they need to be in the production line. Or the bleed out can be what kills them instaed of the cut. As long as they are stunned and they can't feel the pain of a bad slice, then the law covers them. That is not acceptable practice in halal slaughter. 

Certification means that the methoid of slaughter can be audited to confirm its halal status.