Bit of a problem

[drouin4]

I sold a new tablet nearly a month ago, only took it out of box to test and photograph. Worked perfectly.

Posted express to buyer in Australia, it sat at his post office for a week before he picked it up. Later I checked his feedback he is in Hong Kong with AU mailing address.

Now he is now claiming he resold it new to a NZ customer and apperently they said screen burnt out and wifi don't work.

Warranty is now nul and void as it was supposedly sold to NZ.

I have asked him 4 times for a copy of the NZ invoice, name and phone number, he is just beating around the bush asking where to send it back to me. Wont give me any info on them.

I don't believe this is the same tablet that I sold to him or even if he has resold it.

I called ebay and they said he has not sold 1 of my tablet models to anyone, NZ or anywhere. He sells tabs and phones on ebay.

When I told him I checked and none of my model tabs have been sold since mine he is now he is claiming he didn't sell it throught ebay. He still refuses to give me the details of the supposed NZ buyer.

I have all the serial numbers photographed of mine.

Ebay said to communicate with the buyer which I have done from the start.

Has anyone gone throught this sort of thing and what did you do.

Thankyou

[digital*ghost]

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@juliew5030202 wrote:

Ebay ruled in my favour and refunded my payment as he had resold my item.

The next day he opened a paypal dispute. I called paypal and they asked me to cut and paste his messages confirming he resold to NZ and said when they reveive them the case would be closed.

On Saturday paypal sent message to say they ruled in his favour.

So I called paypal again and the woman who answered this time said they would review the messages again and also listen to my last call to them as apparently they were not supposed to ask for my messages between me and him.

This morning I recieve another message from paypal saying case is now closed and as soon as I receive my item back they will refund him, there is also has a tracking number from him.

I am so annoyed that paypal say one thing then do another, is there anything else I can do? Do I accept the parcel when it arrives or what? This has gone on for far too long.

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This is some straight up BS from PayPal, for two main reasons.

One, the buyer protection policy is for items in their received state. If your buyer received the item from you in good working order (which one has to presume they did, since they on-sold it) they are not eligible for Buyer Protection.

S11.1 An item may be considered “significantly not as described” if:

The item is unusable and was not disclosed as such. (Note, this applies to the item in its received state.);

The bit about not including messages is also a lie - this is listed under the Buyer Protection T&Cs, but I can't see how they could make that a clause exclusive to buyers, i.e. allow a buyer to include communications between themselves and the other party to support their case but not a seller:

S11.3 We reserve our right to make a decision if you and the seller cannot agree and we will exercise our sole discretion when determining a claim of “significantly not as described.” We will consider numerous factors which may include the communications between you and the seller and any documentation you have provided. We will provide you with reasons for our decision upon request.

This should be an open & shut case with the FSO, as PayPal did not uphold their own policies. 

[*tippy*toes*]

I would lodge the FOS dispute online. Then you can take your time working through the questions and you can submit it after you've re read everything. Sometimes if you're stressed out, doing things over the phone can see things missed. From memory, there is an area where you can write in details so you could probably cut and paste the emails between yourself and the fraudster buyer. Doing it online also means you can submit it out of hours.

I've lodged one dispute with them against PayPal (different matter) and it was resolved in less than a week with PayPal having their tail between their legs.

[drouin4]

I never thought to ask for a superviser, most of the conversation consisted of this woman speaking over me making me feel very intimidated.

I'm to scared to ring again.

As far as they are concerned, they don't care if he resold it because they said as long as he has it back and returns it back to me I am responsible.

My next question is when I receive it back am I able to verify the serial numbers just by looking at the back of the tablet to see if they match the photos of the one I sold ? Or does one have to turn it on, because apparently the screen has burnt out and I will be unable to do it.

Thankyou

[thecatspjs]

My advice is to lodge a formal appeal with Paypal.IF you spend a little time lining up your ducks before you contact them again.

I think that if you do ring back and request to speak to a supervisor to formally appeal their decision that you need to have clear, succinct points documented ready to make on the phone, as well as in a file format that is ready to send through or be uploaded to paypal.

Such documentation doesn't need to be long, but IMO needs to be written objectively, needs to be supported by evidence (screenshots of messages, references to Paypals  policies etc)

You probably have already covered these things in your dispute response, but include points in an appeal along the lines of DGs references to specific Paypal policies such as acceptance of communications etc, as well as: the goods in this transaction: 

- were accepted by the buyer on delivery, prior to being onsold

- were resold and transported internationally without your knowledge AND by a means (service and packaging) of which you had no control over.

- have been resold, sent and handled by a third party that is unknown to you

I do think it is worth the effort to document this, review and refine if you pursue an appeal with Paypal.

Helpful information for a FOS case if needs be.

[drouin4]

Well, i've tried everything suggested and paypal sent a final reply saying he won and took the $448 out of my account after he returned a burnt out screen Tablet.

Thankyou

[*tippy*toes*]

Was it the one you sent though? I still wouldn't leave it there. Lodge a dispute with the FOS. Let them decide. 

[thecatspjs]

There is something wrong with the timing here.

Paypal dispute opened and decided, in a couple of days, paypal appeal decided in a couple of days, mmm highly unusual.

What date was the paypal dispute actually opened by the buyer ?

[drouin4]

I just spoke to a paypal superviser, he said that ebay messages between me and my buyer are not taken into consideration when deciding on a case.

He said my buyer said he turned it on and it burnt out, he did not say it was resold and went by plane to NZ.

Even though I sent proof to paypal with my all buyers messages with mention of his NZ buyer, he said they are only messages, not proof it was sent to NZ or resold.

They do not want to know.........I am soo angry.

Warranty will not be covered by Samsung because its been half way round the world and god only know how it was packaged by him.

Paypal basically told me to lie to Samsung and tell them when I turned it on it burnt out.

It was returned back to me with a different company seals (my buyer has another big business and he resold through this company) than the original ones which had been torn through on the opened box, it was also just thrown in a satchel. When I sent it originally I packaged in another box over top with plenty of bubble wrap to protect.

For all I know he may have swapped the back with my serial numbers as I am unable to turn it on.

Paypal don't care, I told them everything, and they believe this liar even with all my proof.

[thecatspjs]

What date was the dispute opened in paypal?
Did you accept a return at any point ?
Did you respond to the case in writing?
Have you uploaded any supporting evidence in the initial dispute?
Were you able to submit a written appeal?
Did you communicate with buyer via eb messages ? Or email?

[thecatspjs]

I would like to help you, and i know you are angry and upset, but just need to clarify some facts.