eBay

jebedar123 · ‎19-09-2022

I sold a laptop. The buyer complained about the battery and took it for service to check they said it needed to change the battery and the whole top chassis of the laptop (all free of charge because it is still under warranty).

The buyer returned the laptop, and so I took it to repairs to get it checked. To my surprise, the technician told me it had already been serviced with a new battery and a keyboard while it was in the buyer's custody.

So my question is, since the item has been tampered with and modified, can I refuse the return? Consequently, this isn't the exact item I sold; it has new/different parts from what I sold. So, can I refuse the return based on it alone, right? They shouldn't have sent the laptop for service before sending it back, right?

I appreciate any help you can provide.

jellybirddesigns · ‎20-09-2022

It's is a weird situation to be in, that's for sure. No idea why a buyer would go to the trouble of having repairs carried out and then send it back. I mean...why not keep it after all that?

However, I don't really see the point of refusing the return. Sending it back to the buyer would probably just result in a case being opened, which can be a lot more risky. The buyer obviously doesn't want to take the chance that something else could go wrong and they returned it on their own dime.

It sounds like the laptop is in better shape than before, so you should have no trouble reselling it. Just refund the buyer, and re-list it. You don't even have to mention that there have been repairs.

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gutterpunkz05 · ‎20-09-2022

As soon as the buyer claimed faulty battery, you were doomed. There is a way around it, but it was not included in your listing. As far as the refund goes, as you have received the item back, you have 3 days to complete the refund or ebay will do it for you. Ebay is only interested in the fact you have received the item back, as to it being serviced, you will be hard pressed to prove, the when, where and by whom, at least to ebays satisfaction.

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gutterpunkz05 · ‎20-09-2022

As long as you are aware, that if ebay are required to resolve the issue, it will count as a defect against your sales metrics, and as you are a low volume seller it may be enough to result in ebay applying higher sales fees, and other selling/listing restrictions, to your account.

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springyzone · ‎20-09-2022

I see it like this. You are in a no win situation if you want to harp on about the letter of the law.

You are correct: A buyer should not alter an item or modify it or any of that sort of thing if they are seeking to return it. It should be returned in the condition it was received.

However, if an item is faulty and those faults were not disclosed in the ad, then the buyer is entitled to a full refund and the seller should be paying for the return postage, what is more.

So technically, I guess ebay could say the buyer was not eligible to return the item because of the repairs. But on the other hand, if you contact ebay and tell them that not only the battery, but the whole top chassis of the laptop had to be replaced, that sort of proves the buyer's point, doesn't it? That the item was faulty.

What if ebay then gave a full refund to the buyer, but without making them return it? Wouldn't be the first time that sort of thing has happened. (edit: I see it has been returned already, but theoretically...)

You can certainly refuse the return, you can contact ebay help and chat to them, but the danger is ebay doesn't always follow its own policies and you could still find yourself more out of pocket than if you accept a return.

Up to you which way you fall, but if I were an ebay rep listening to all this, I'd probably push through the refund for the buyer. My reasoning would be-you, the seller, had already confirmed it needed repairs that weren't mentioned in the listing, so the item was not as described. One strike against you. Two, it wasn't as if the item was damaged, it was sent back in better shape than received. That probably only happens in ebay land once in a blue moon. And three, the buyer has already returned it so it is too much rigmarole to try to reverse the process.

If you by chance did fight it and win and the buyer had to pay to get it posted back-what if they then claim some other new fault (which I think a buyer might easily do if they really didn't want it), then you're back to square 1.

You've got it in your little hot hands, just relist the thing, stating the marvellous new parts and warranty it has.

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padi*0409 · ‎19-09-2022

Why on earth would you want to refuse the return - you've got the laptop back in better condition than you sent it, at no cost to yourself.......

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"Start me up I'll never stop......"

jebedar123 · ‎19-09-2022

Thanks for the input. BTW, It is a great laptop, but that's not the point. I want to sell it! Do I have grounds to refuse the return? It isn't the same equipment that was sold. The buyer sent it to be fixed without my authorization, so he shouldn't be able to return it, right?

I'm not looking for the ethical thing. I want this sold. If I had to re-enlist again I'd have to put in the description as "Refurbished" or "Serviced"... the equipment was devalued in my opinion.

Has anyone ever seen this thing happen before?

Input is appreciated.

padi*0409 · ‎19-09-2022

@jebedar123 wrote:

If I had to re-enlist again I'd have to put in the description as "Refurbished" or "Serviced"... the equipment was devalued in my opinion.

No, just say new battery and keyboard replaced under warranty, that still has "X" months to go.

______________________________________________________

"Start me up I'll never stop......"

jebedar123 · ‎19-09-2022

I 100% agree with you if that was the case, but I don't think you understood my question. It is about how ebay should be ruling here.

Quoting ebay "If an item is returned used, altered or damaged, it may be appropriate to issue a partial refund to the buyer.".

Note the "altered". The question is simple, I want this sold. I have documentation that the buyer "altered" the item before returning it. Can I refuse the return?

BTW, this question was already posted and answered but it was in the USA community by mistake, here it is:

https://community.ebay.com/t5/Ask-a-Mentor/Ebay-return-with-a-twist/m-p/33226317#M273941

padi*0409 · ‎19-09-2022

@jebedar123 wrote:

Quoting ebay "If an item is returned used, altered or damaged, it may be appropriate to issue a partial refund to the buyer.".

eBay may well see it as the laptop being "improved" through a warranty repair, and rule against you if the buyer opens a formal dispute with them.

Note the "altered". The question is simple, I want this sold. I have documentation that the buyer "altered" the item before returning it. Can I refuse the return?

Read what I said above, but note that if you refuse a return and eBay rules against you, you will have a defect put on your selling account, and as a "new seller" that's the last thing you need.........

Edit. Just refund the buyer, you're in a win/win situation, the laptop is in better condition now compared to when you sold it.

______________________________________________________

"Start me up I'll never stop......"

jebedar123 · ‎19-09-2022

"Read what I said above, but note that if you refuse a return and eBay rules against you, you will have a defect put on your selling account, and as a "new seller" that's the last thing you need........."

I didn't say anything about refusing a return. I want eBay to rule in my favour. But still, you have a good point that should be mentioned in this conversation.

"eBay may well see it as the laptop being "improved" through a warranty repair, and rule against you if the buyer opens a formal dispute with them."

Read what I said about the "cause" of the return. The buyer says the laptop isn't what it was advertised because the battery was faulty. If that's the case, eBay shouldn't honour the return because as you said... the item is better and "improved" so there is no reason to return the item since it is working perfectly with extra 3 years warranty on the battery and keyboard... understand what I'm saying now?

Regardless, what you've mentioned has helped me think a bit.

padi*0409 · ‎19-09-2022

@jebedar123 wrote:

Read what I said about the "cause" of the return. The buyer says the laptop isn't what it was advertised because the battery was faulty. If that's the case, eBay shouldn't honour the return because as you said... the item is better and "improved" so there is no reason to return the item since it is working perfectly with extra 3 years warranty on the battery and keyboard... understand what I'm saying now?

But it wasn't just the battery that was faulty, there was apparently a problem with the keyboard as well. As I said before if the buyer opens a formal dispute with eBay through the MBG and you refuse to refund them, eBay will likely rule in the buyer's favour citing that you should have been aware of the problems before listing it - it matters little whether you were or not, the fact is they were faulty and there may be furthur undisclosed problems with the laptop.

eBay will nearly always rule against the seller in disputes, that's well-known on the boards - and in your case since there were proven faults in the laptop, it's even more likely that the dispute will go in the buyers favour.

You are also lucky that the buyer gave you a positive feedback for the transaction, presumably they didn't know of the battery problem at that stage.

I'll advise again, just refund the buyer and relist the laptop - you may get more or less for it the second time around. But by refusing the refund I honestly believe you're on a hiding to nowhere.

______________________________________________________

"Start me up I'll never stop......"

janeababe · ‎20-09-2022

@jebedar123 wrote:
I 100% agree with you if that was the case, but I don't think you understood my question. It is about how ebay should be ruling here.
Quoting ebay "If an item is returned used, altered or damaged, it may be appropriate to issue a partial refund to the buyer.".

Note the "altered". The question is simple, I want this sold. I have documentation that the buyer "altered" the item before returning it. Can I refuse the return?

BTW, this question was already posted and answered but it was in the USA community by mistake, here it is:

https://community.ebay.com/t5/Ask-a-Mentor/Ebay-return-with-a-twist/m-p/33226317#M273941

-The laptop has not been altered. It has been repaired. (Under warranty), so no legs to stand on there!

-it was sold used, so no legs to stand on there……

-it isn’t damaged, it’s in better condition now, than when you sold it, so no legs to stand on there, either!

Let’s cut to the crux of it…. You don’t want to part with your $3K!! And that’s what all this is boiling down too.

As ALREADY SUGGESTED….. accept the return, refund the buyer, and relist. You could probably add an extra $100-$200 on it this time because it’s actually in better condition than when you first sold it!

Hype it up….. Brand new blah blah blah………. Etc etc etc…….

Try and be a seller with morals! Because so far, I haven’t seen any from you!

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jebedar123 · ‎20-09-2022

I understand what you are saying; however, you also made a big mistake of assuming I have no morals as a seller. I advertised the item and sold it and I don't want to do the work again. It has nothing to do with morals. If the buyer had a problem with the item, he/she/they shouldn't have pressed the buy button! If the item was damaged, they should have sent it back as it was received. Furthermore, I got a great review because I even kept in contact with the buyer after they received and inspected the items and I intend to keep having open communication with the buyer if I can; I want to solve this problem. This world is already screwed up without people with your stand attacking individuals with nothing to back it up.

Unfortunately, this thread was nothing like the one in the eBay USA community where they told exactly what I wanted in a very simple sentence, unfortunately under the wrong jurisdiction.

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Ebay return with a twist