Postage of fakes

[fixnwear]

Hello to all,

I have read many times on the boards that if the fake is susspected  that one doesn't have to send it back as it's illegal!

What a load of cods wallop

How does a recipient of a fake item thinks it got to him/her in the first place?

Through the post, in most cases. Australia Post delivered it OK!

Post office doesn't care/wouldn't know what is fake, all parcels are sealed - and besides, it's not their job to police that sort of thing.

Advice given to buyers  here is so misleading, a great cop out - not having to go to any trouble of returning someone else's property, fake or not - if full refund is promised or even already issued.

I have also spoken to PP - their attitude is the same.

If the buyer claims a fake item and doesn't have anything official to support that claim - they'll have to return it to the seller in order to get the refund. If the seller agrees, of course.

They also are not willing to act as a police - to determine what is fake and what isn't - nor they are in too much of a hurry to tell anyone to distroy someone else's proerty rather than to post it back - as some sellers want the item back even if it is a fake.

Then the rights owner can take it up with them, not the PO or PP.

The only thing that the PO told me it would worry them is people posting flamable or otherwise hazardous items/material.

And finally, if the item has to be returned to an overseas country, going through the customs - again, no problem at all, singular items, or small quantities get here - and they can go back just  the same.

Customs guys wouldn't give it a time of day - unless is a shippping container load! (Straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak)

[modestbods]

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Nothing in AusPost guidelines ( for Australian delivery ) supports the

'no fakes in mail' scenario.

---

Sorry, but you're wrong there.

Okay, for yours & the OP's benefit...

Australia Post Terms and Conditions http://auspost.com.au/media/documents/AP-TCs-Sep-2014.pdf

62 Prohibited goods

62.1 The following prohibited goods shall not be lodged for carriage by post and are
prohibited from carriage by post:

62.1.1 any article whose possession or carriage by post is prohibited by a law of the
Commonwealth, a State or Territory; (see below)

Under the Trade Marks Act 1995, it is an offence to:

> falsify a registered trade mark

> falsely apply a registered trade mark

> alter or remove a trade mark knowing it is a registered trade mark

> make a die or equipment that can help in falsifying or removing a trade mark

> sell, possess, distribute or import a good, knowing that the trade mark has been falsified or removed

The Copyright Act 1968 similarly provides for criminal sanctions. Under this Act it is an offence to:

> knowingly import, possess, sell, distribute or commercially deal with an infringing copy

> offer for sale infringing copies of computer programs

> transmit a computer program to enable it to be copied when received

The Copyright Act 1968 provides for individuals to be fined up to $50,000 and for corporations to be fined up to $250 000. The possible term of imprisonment is up to five years.

The penalties under the Trade Marks Act 1995 are sentences up to two years and fines of up to $55,000.

Btw OP, you can't claim you didn't 'know' an item was a fake/counterfeit when you've just claimed for a refund via Paypal on those exact grounds.

 Paypal can thus only rightfully/lawfully instruct you to; destroy it, or to refer it to authorities, or to contact the trade mark/copyright owner & turn it over to them/destroy it on their instructions. If they tell you to keep it or to return it to the sender they would thereby be telling you to do something illegal, and potentially even criminal.

Now do you finally understand why you can't/shouldn't return a fake to the seller?

[cq_tech]

Possession of counterfeit items must clearly be illegal as market stall operators are frequently prosecuted for possession of same, while the counterfeit goods themselves are confiscated and ultimately destroyed.

On that basis, if possession is illegal, then posting same through AP is also illegal. Paypal obviouslyly agree as they no longer require fake items to be returned to sellers, but request that they be destroyed instead and photographic evidence provided of same.

[modestbods]

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Nothing in AusPost guidelines ( for Australian delivery ) supports the

'no fakes in mail' scenario.

---

Okay, for yours & the OP's benefit...

 http://auspost.com.au/media/documents/AP-TCs-Sep-2014.pdf

 Australia Post Terms and Conditions

62 Prohibited goods

62.1 The following prohibited goods shall not be lodged for carriage by post and are prohibited from carriage by post:

62.1.1 any article whose possession or carriage by post is prohibited by a law of the Commonwealth, a State or Territory (see below)

http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/ip-infringement/counterfeiting-and-piracy/

Criminal Liability

Under the Trade Marks Act 1995, it is an offence to:

• falsify a registered trade mark
• falsely apply a registered trade mark
• alter or remove a trade mark knowing it is a registered trade mark
• make a die or equipment that can help in falsifying or removing a trade mark
• sell, possess, distribute or import a good, knowing that the trade mark has been falsified or removed

The Copyright Act 1968 similarly provides for criminal sanctions. Under this Act it is an offence to:

• knowingly import, possess, sell, distribute or commercially deal with an infringing copy
• offer for sale infringing copies of computer programs
• transmit a computer program to enable it to be copied when received

The Copyright Act 1968 provides for individuals to be fined up to $50,000 and for corporations to be fined up to $250,000. The possible term of imprisonment is up to five years.

The penalties under the Trade Marks Act 1995 are sentences up to two years and fines of up to $55,000

Btw, you can't claim you didn't 'know' an item was a fake/counterfeit when you've just claimed for a refund via Paypal on those exact grounds.

 Paypal can thus only rightfully/lawfully instruct you to; destroy it, or to refer it to authorities, or to contact the trade mark/copyright owner & turn it over to them/destroy it on their instructions. If they tell you to keep it or to return it to the sender they would thereby be telling you to do something illegal, and potentially even criminal.

Now do you finally understand why you can't/shouldn't return a fake to the seller?

[modestbods]

---

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Nothing in AusPost guidelines ( for Australian delivery ) supports the

'no fakes in mail' scenario.

---

Sorry, but you're wrong there.

Okay, for yours & the OP's benefit...

 http://auspost.com.au/media/documents/AP-TCs-Sep-2014.pdf

 Australia Post Terms and Conditions

62 Prohibited goods

62.1 The following prohibited goods shall not be lodged for carriage by post and are prohibited from carriage by post:

62.1.1 any article whose possession or carriage by post is prohibited by a law of the Commonwealth, a State or Territory (see below)

http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/ip-infringement/counterfeiting-and-piracy/

Criminal Liability

Under the Trade Marks Act 1995, it is an offence to:

• falsify a registered trade mark
• falsely apply a registered trade mark
• alter or remove a trade mark knowing it is a registered trade mark
• make a die or equipment that can help in falsifying or removing a trade mark
• sell, possess, distribute or import a good, knowing that the trade mark has been falsified or removed

The Copyright Act 1968 similarly provides for criminal sanctions. Under this Act it is an offence to:

• knowingly import, possess, sell, distribute or commercially deal with an infringing copy
• offer for sale infringing copies of computer programs
• transmit a computer program to enable it to be copied when received

The Copyright Act 1968 provides for individuals to be fined up to $50,000 and for corporations to be fined up to $250,000. The possible term of imprisonment is up to five years.

The penalties under the Trade Marks Act 1995 are sentences up to two years and fines of up to $55,000

Btw, you can't claim you didn't 'know' an item was a fake/counterfeit when you've just claimed for a refund via Paypal on those exact grounds.

 Paypal can thus only rightfully/lawfully instruct you to; destroy it, or to refer it to authorities, or to contact the trade mark/copyright owner & turn it over to them/destroy it on their instructions. If they tell you to keep it or to return it to the sender they would thereby be telling you to do something illegal, and potentially even criminal.

Now do you finally understand why you can't/shouldn't return a fake to the seller?

[modestbods]

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Nothing in AusPost guidelines ( for Australian delivery ) supports the

'no fakes in mail' scenario.

---

Okay, for yours & the OP's benefit...

 Australia Post Terms and Conditions

62 Prohibited goods

62.1 The following prohibited goods shall not be lodged for carriage by post and are prohibited from carriage by post:

62.1.1 any article whose possession or carriage by post is prohibited by a law of the Commonwealth, a State or Territory (see below)

http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/ip-infringement/counterfeiting-and-piracy/

Criminal Liability

Under the Trade Marks Act 1995, it is an offence to:

• falsify a registered trade mark
• falsely apply a registered trade mark
• alter or remove a trade mark knowing it is a registered trade mark
• make a die or equipment that can help in falsifying or removing a trade mark
• sell, possess, distribute or import a good, knowing that the trade mark has been falsified or removed

The Copyright Act 1968 similarly provides for criminal sanctions. Under this Act it is an offence to:

• knowingly import, possess, sell, distribute or commercially deal with an infringing copy
• offer for sale infringing copies of computer programs
• transmit a computer program to enable it to be copied when received

The Copyright Act 1968 provides for individuals to be fined up to $50,000 and for corporations to be fined up to $250,000. The possible term of imprisonment is up to five years.

The penalties under the Trade Marks Act 1995 are sentences up to two years and fines of up to $55,000

Btw, you can't claim you didn't 'know' an item was a fake/counterfeit when you've just claimed for a refund via Paypal on those exact grounds.

 Paypal can thus only rightfully/lawfully instruct you to; destroy it, or to refer it to authorities, or to contact the trade mark/copyright owner & turn it over to them/destroy it on their instructions. If they tell you to keep it or to return it to the sender they would thereby be telling you to do something illegal, and potentially even criminal.

Now do you finally understand why you can't/shouldn't return a fake to the seller?

[digital*ghost]

---

@cq_tech wrote:
Possession of counterfeit items must clearly be illegal as market stall operators are frequently prosecuted for possession of same, 

---

When I was looking for supporting information to this thread, while I still believed and understood that posting fakes was not ok, I couldn't find information to either prove or disprove it. 

I see modest has, though, so kudos. 🙂 

[black*poppy]

Well presented modestbods, many thanks for clarifying the issue so well.

[i-love-my-sheep]

Uh-ohhhhh, I'd better not send my sisters kids chocolate coins at Christmas this year because they look just like Australian currency!!

[Anonymous]

modestbods.

Your citation is not from AusPost, it's part of the Customs regulations.

Can you provide a web link to the AusPost regs you have claimed ?

[modestbods]

lmao if only you knew 

hang on, i'll brb