Post office retuned to sender, Seller and eBay won’t refund!!

[usersambo]

I purchased an item, asked seller to put delivery instructions on parcel, because I work away from home, I have a parcel delivery box, works perfectly for years, received hundreds of parcels this way never had issues, now I’ve had my first issue,

The seller ignores my delivery instructions and sends it requesting signature, the post office return to sender due to I was unable to collect it.

The issue I’m having is the seller has my item, won’t resend it with delivery instructions, so I completed a dispute, eBay won’t refund because the seller provides tracking, so I appealed it, eBay still won’t do anything

So now I have no item, no refund, no nothing, and it seems I have been ripped off!?

What can I do now?

Thanks for any help.

[springyzone]

I don't know what paypal will decide but if i had to judge I would say the seller was not in the wrong as such. He sent the parcel to the correct address, requiring signature, which i am sure a lot of sellers would do to cover themselves.

Now that he has the parcel returned because you weren't able to collect it, I think you are entitled to the cost of the item back. But I don't see that you should necessarily be entitled to postage costs back because the seller did spend that. I'm a bit surprised the seller hasn't just offered youa  refund less postage. Re-sending isn't going to work as you'll strike the same problem as last time.

[melbourneclearance]

I absolutely agree, springy.

I think the only way to get some refund is to negotiate with the seller here. Contacting PayPal won't help, especially since ebay has already washed their hands. While the seller's behaviour of not refunding anything is wrong, it depends a bit on how the initial contact from the OP after things went wrong went. I remember a case when a buyer gave me an incomplete address (no street name) and AP returned the parcel, my buyer gave me a red dot THEN sent me with the correct address. It could be argued that I should have checked every address before sending anything, so I guess I bore some partial blame for not seeing that there was no street name. But giving me a red dot before negotiation when the bigger blame was on the buyer wasn't going to get a good deal out of me. I made him revise the red dot and pay for a second postage to the correct address.

[tangledstitches]

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@springyzonewrote:

I don't know what paypal will decide but if i had to judge I would say the seller was not in the wrong as such. He sent the parcel to the correct address, requiring signature, which i am sure a lot of sellers would do to cover themselves.

Now that he has the parcel returned because you weren't able to collect it, I think you are entitled to the cost of the item back. But I don't see that you should necessarily be entitled to postage costs back because the seller did spend that. I'm a bit surprised the seller hasn't just offered youa  refund less postage. Re-sending isn't going to work as you'll strike the same problem as last time.

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They can sign a waiver so that someone at the PO can sign on their behalf.  A lot of people who live on rural properties do this.  It's not something I would ever do because it defeats the purpose of paying for registered post (as a buyer), but it shouldn't be a problem for a seller.

[melbourneclearance]

But in this case the seller WANTED a signature.

The OP here as a buyer had the option to sign a waiver, but many buyers simply do not have anyone who can go to the post office and pick up a parcel, even with the half Saturday that AP is now open for. There were other options, of course, like redirecting the parcel to work, etc.

Either way, the seller had not committed any crime or scam, he sent the item, the fact that the buyer could not pick it up or redirect it was not the seller's problem. The seller has some responsibility for not reading (or chose not to) the delivery instructions which may have avoided the problem. But ultimately it was the buyer's responsibility to make steps to retrieve the parcel if AP couldn't deliver it.

This is a little grey area on eBay. Many sellers insist on a signature on delivery to cover themselves, many buyers simply do not have the option to sign for a parcel. And AP returns the parcel to sender.

A simple refund the original price of the item and let the buyer pay the postage may not be a solution either. What if the item is a customised item? What if the item is perishable? Also, the seller is still stuck with eBay's Final Value Fee for the whole transaction as eBay does not partially refund FVF.

[digital*ghost]

This is kind of true. Buyers do have the right to request specific delivery options, however the time to do that is actually before purchase, not at the point of sale / payment by leaving a message. To put that into proper perspective, a buyer can't buy from a seller who is using couriers only and leave a note saying "post via Australia Post only" then expect the seller to do whatever they have told them to (delivery instructions aren't for telling the seller how to post, they're for the delivery itself, like "leave behind the side gate" - to change or ensure a specific postage method, it needs to be requested or confirmed before purchase, particularly as this can adjust the costs of the service). The same applies if the seller's default is to send with SOD.

Not sure if this seller's default method is SOD, or whether the item was valued over $750 so would have required SOD, but I do know that many can get a little sketchy when the buyer asks for postage methods that they think offer less protection, especially if the request isn't explained, and for some sellers such a request (if made without context) will prompt them to take every precaution they can. 

These days, SOD (on parcels) doesn't really give the seller greater protection unless the sale was $750+, though, since adding SOD won't help in an eBay INR if the package is never delivered (and to note, both 'attempted delivery' and 'awaiting collection' are considered delivered by eBay standards, and their policy states that the buyer is responsible for collecting the item - that's why the OP would not have been successful with a claim).  

[imastawka]

I'd like to point out that I've had a couple of parcels delivered lately that were SOD,

but were left at the door.  

One was Auspost  and the other was a courier.  Neither was an expensive item.

SOD wasn't requested.

So starting to think SOD doesn't mean anything anymore.  

[melbourneclearance]

I get that too, but I know all my delivery slaves well. They just leave everything at my door if nobody is home. Once even a small and can easily be taken away almost $1000 worth of parcel...

[lyndal1838]

Stawks, these days AP can leave a SOD parcel if it is safe to do so.....there should be a photo on file showing where it was left in case there is any dispute about it being left.

StarTrack couriers is the same.....as you would expect as they are owned by AP.

I have also heard over the courier grapevine that some other companies are doing the same thing but cannot confirm this from personal experience.  One of our favourite couriers (Fastway) do safe drop if the sender puts that instruction on the parcel.  The company that I buy from always asks if the buyer wants to leave delivery instructions,

[brerrabbit585]

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@melbourneclearancewrote:

But in this case the seller WANTED a signature.

The OP here as a buyer had the option to sign a waiver, but many buyers simply do not have anyone who can go to the post office and pick up a parcel, even with the half Saturday that AP is now open for. There were other options, of course, like redirecting the parcel to work, etc.

Either way, the seller had not committed any crime or scam, he sent the item, the fact that the buyer could not pick it up or redirect it was not the seller's problem. The seller has some responsibility for not reading (or chose not to) the delivery instructions which may have avoided the problem. But ultimately it was the buyer's responsibility to make steps to retrieve the parcel if AP couldn't deliver it.

This is a little grey area on eBay. Many sellers insist on a signature on delivery to cover themselves, many buyers simply do not have the option to sign for a parcel. And AP returns the parcel to sender.

A simple refund the original price of the item and let the buyer pay the postage may not be a solution either. What if the item is a customised item? What if the item is perishable? Also, the seller is still stuck with eBay's Final Value Fee for the whole transaction as eBay does not partially refund FVF.

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You're misunderstanding how the waiver works.  The person receiving the item basically waives their right to expect to sign for the parcel and the PO delivers SOD/registered parcels as they would a normal parcel, but I'd imagine it'd be recorded somewhere at some stage (in these days tracking would automatically show it had got as far as the delivery PO)..  The seller would never know there was no signature from the buyer and they would be covered in exactly the same way as if there had been.

I can understand that the seller in this case might have heard warning bells as soon as they saw the delivery instructions.  Unfortunately, in this case we've been given too few details to know the situation or give advice.

[melbourneclearance]

"The seller would never know there was no signature from the buyer "

The seller will know as soon as he/she asks AP for it. Some sellers request these proofs of signature from AP as soon as their parcels are delivered as a part of their routine.