Item-specific Listing Removed Sick Of It???

[pandorasbox*2013]

Ebay has a specific category for Golliwogs under Dolls. There are over 30 listed. Mine was removed as it was reported and removed under the Hateful & Racist policy. Why would they have a specific category for an item if they are only going to remove it because obviously someone who has issues is offended.!!

[harley_babes_hoard]

..........and no announcement anywhere either

[digital*ghost]

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@agoraagogo wrote:
my jemima doll was adorable and i actually think having her in my life made me feel that being black was ok. as a child i'd see her smiling face on packs of self-raising flour too. she may have been a slave cook or an employee. but as a child looking at that i'd just see my doll. i remember being very attracted to that image.

the history is important. i agree with that. however things morph, soften, get diluted. i'd never call my african american friend a n.... but i call myself a wog. to own the word is to have power over it not it over you.

some time ago i sold a black chalkware wall hanging chef. looked like a golly. possibly meant to depict a slave cook. don't know for sure but he was very cute. if anyone had told be it was offensive i'd have tossed it. i don't think it was. are the black vintage bobblehead dolls of children offensive too?

the only thing i dislike more that racism is fundamentalism.

it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

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Thanks for your comments, I do appreciate where you're coming from, but I still kinda feel my main point is being missed.

I'm going to try to put a similar situation into a different context. The comparison is imperfect, but I hope people can bear with me here and try to see the point I was trying to make from the beginning - that being to try and prompt people to stop viewing the issue intrspectively, and try to see the point of view of someone who does find the doll offensive. 

Let's say a kid is playing with a new toy. It's got all sorts of awesome features, they follow the instructions to build this playset, and then they get to experiment with some other features of the toy, so they're learning a lot of cool things about a range of things - anything from building (technical design) to science (chemistry). The kid isn't aware of anything except they like playing with this toy, and it might even spark a life-long love of science, which is awesome.

Someone else comes along and sees that the toy set actually gets kids to construct replicas of the twin towers, then blow them up.

Is that offensive? Would it be ok to allow the commercial sale of a toy like that?

Children - or people - being unaware of what something means or represents to others doesn't mean the item in question is ok in a broader sense. The world just can't work like that. 

If these dolls weren't based on gross caricatures and stereotypes applied to black people, and were available in every colour under the sun, there'd be no problem. But they were, and they're not, so there is.

I wasn't able to respond to this comment earlier, but I want to say now that yes, racism absolutely is a part of the world's history, but do you want to know why people can't just "get over it"? Because sadly, it's very much a part of our present. And when people try to move forward, to change that, to remove icons that are - as I said earlier - symbols of intolerance from popular culture, being dismissed as "PC gone mad" keeps it part of our present. 😞 

[imastawka]

If Australia is to be 'shamed' by these dolls, then they need to

get their act together IMO

American seller  # 331626135806

I've seen items listed as 'squaw' - just as bad IMO

I respect your point of view digi,  but it's getting to the point

of ramming it down everyone's throats  and I don't see

the relevance in Australia.

[digital*ghost]

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@imastawka wrote:

I respect your point of view digi,  but it's getting to the point

of ramming it down everyone's throats  and I don't see

the relevance in Australia.

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It's not my intention to ram anything down anyone's throat. I am only trying to outlay a different perspective,and have made more than one attempt simply because by and large the responses seem (to me) to stick to individual, personal perspective.

How can it not be relevant in Australia? It isn't exclusively an American issue, though current events in the US are more than likely what prompted the sudden ban.

eBay's handling of the issue is a different thing all together. Introducing new policies and issuing violations at the same time is ridiculous, applpying it selectively even more so. 

Edited to add: I'm pretty sure eBay are legally required to provide advance notice of policy changes, which surely would extend to restricted and prohibited items, not just things like fee changes etc, so perhaps (if correct) that might provide some come-back for affected sellers. 

[black*poppy]

I totally agree DG.

I haven't seen the removal of all black dolls in toy stores.  I'm sure that even recently I saw newborn replica dolls in black and white versions, etc.  I'll have to check again.

BUT these types of dolls aren't racist - in fact it could be argued that it's racism by exclusion to not have them, like people of colour other than white don't exist, or aren't valued enough to have their own doll versions. Ethically, the market should reflect that our community is made up of all types of people.

But golliwogs have very strong negative connontations from the past - minstrel shows, black face etc and if ebay decides this is not part of their ethos then fair enough for them.  Ebay is not a democracy after all.

There should have been an announcement though.  Surprising really, it might have been good PR for ebay to say "we are such a great bunch look at what we have done to improve your trading experience" blah blah blah.

[agoraagogo]

imastawka said...

"...and I don't see the relevance in Australia."


during australia's early history islanders were abducted and brought by force to work australia's queensland cane fields.

there was slavery in this country.

therefore one could argue it has transferred relevance.

[swap-cards-and-more]

I had a heap of listings removed yesterday and thought that they were being removed because of the use of the word as it ended in "wog" so I changed my listings to Golly Doll and 40 mins ago they were all removed and this email from ebay:

After reviewing your account, we've had to take the following action:
- Some or all of your listings may have been removed. A list of any removed items will be listed further down in this email.
- We have credited all associated fees except for the final value fee for your listing(s).

In accordance with feedback from our community, we have made the decision to prohibit the sale of golliwog dolls and many associated products from our site globally. We believe this is the right thing to do and is consistent with our values as a business. This is not a reflection or judgement on anyone selling the item. We thank you for your understanding and ask you to please not list these kinds of items.

[imastawka]

Nah.....sorrry......too much overthinking of the subject for my liking.

[harley_babes_hoard]

this reply wasn't for you in particular Stawka sorry.

for goodness sake should we remove any memorabilia to do with wars, I'm sure some people somewhere find them offensive too.it the same darn thing it's our history move on.

[imastawka]

I knew that, HBH.   

So,  removal of listings before a change/notification of policy.

Sounds about right.   That sub-category is still there.

Seems Aussie listings are ok, as long as you don't sell overseas

So no Aussie relevance apparently - gollies are ok here