Postage and people complaining about cost

[silver-fox-bullion]

It been really eye opening reading so many people complaining about postage costs. The thing that gets me there must be alot of sellers running business like selling but NOT abn registered. If they were your postage is FREE no matter what it costs. As all postage costs are a tax write off for business. Just something to think about

[andrew0123]

Well, GST is a tax that makes it very hard for seller's to become millionaires. You could explain to people how it's logical but people don't like taxes. 

So does that mean I can't claim GST on fees as a deduction on my tax return? (i'm also on a disability pension and need to hand in a profit loss to centrelink for the first time and my first tax return in many years).

I like detailed answers digital ghost. I think the issue people have with GST on fees is that ebay do not pay taxes in Australia. 

[digital*ghost]

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@andrew0123 wrote:

I think the issue people have with GST on fees is that ebay do not pay taxes in Australia. 

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I tend to think being able to add GST to their fees was the government's way of getting some form of tax revenue generated via eBay (and others, since it applies to all similar online marketplaces). Getting eBay to pay tax from their revenue would have been preferred for many (or so I assume), but at the same time I think most people assume this would have been passed on to members in the form of increased fees anyway, so it's kind of a potayto / potahto situation, in a practical sense. 

When you do your tax return, you can claim all expenses incurred to run the business as a tax deduction, it's better to talk to an accountant for specific advice as to what counts and what doesn't in any cgiven circumstance, but that's the general rule. Things are a little different for sellers like me (i.e. the GST portion of my revenue is not part of my taxable income, and the GST I pay is not a deductibe expense when I do my income tax return), but for all non-registered sellers, it is an expense. 

I understand no one likes taxes - nor does my bank account, which gets a little depressed every 3 months when I do my BAS and hand over all the GST I've collected. Yes, if I could make the revenue I do now without automatically handing over 1/11th of it every 3 months, I might have hit more goals by now. Or maybe I could be buying slightly nicer things, or slightly better quality business equipment, but the situation is a little more nuanced than that (I don't want to get too much into that, but as a quick example, as a supply seller, my business is more attractive and often cheaper to other businesses who are registered for GST). Overall, I don't feel my business (or its growth potential) is inhibited by it, to be honest. 

[gutterpunkz05]

Maths  V's flawed logic

https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/math/a25591/riddle-of-the-week-19/

[andrew0123]

So the regulars on this forum do not deal with ethical issues; are just conveyer's of the law. I guess worrying about these things doesn't make it fun when making 20 posts a day. Also tax or gst, you will never get it back dollar for dollar. So, be thrify with your all your expenses. 

[digital*ghost]

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@andrew0123 wrote:

So the regulars on this forum do not deal with ethical issues; are just conveyer's of the law. 

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This thread didn't pose an ethical question to discuss, it suggested that there is a law that would make GST on the fees on postage illegal somehow, ergo the current laws as far as they are known / interpreted were up for discussion. (I still don't understand how, I mean, I own the items I sell, as do most sellers who aren't registered for GST, so if the GST on fees for the postage portion is not legal, because postage is "BYO", then by the same logic, GST on the FVF for the item price would be similarly illegal, because sellers "BYO" their items, too, but I again digress).

If the OP was simply "charging fees on postage is unethical, and - by the same token - so is the government getting GST from those fees", what course could that discussion take, do you think? I can summarise it for you, to save some time, based on the countless threads that have been posted here with that very premise.

A bunch of posts from Group A replying "I agree, what can we do about it?" (which, if you prod further, is generally more of a "why hasn't someone else done something about it?"). Plus a bunch of posts from Group B replying "I agree, but there's nothing we can do about it" which has a tendency to devolve in to a sub-section of the thread where members from Group A accuse members from Group B of being sheeple. Then there will be some members in Group C who will suggest reasons why these changes were brought in - members from Group A will often levy similar accusations at Group C, not being able to think for themselves, and / or that they are eBay employees planted in the forum to defend eBay from any and all accusations of wrong-doing. 

If someone came to the forum and posted something more like this:

Since eBay introduced FVF on postage, I have always felt it was an unethical thing to do, but sadly after several years of advocating for change, it's become clear that large coporations don't seem to care about what us schlubs on the ground find to be ethical or not. Once I figured that out, I still couldn't let it go and just try to build and run my business in a way that was the most advantageous to me, and I also felt that there would be a legal way to fight the change and have it repealed. So, I spent quite a large portion of my time researching countless laws independently (because I couldn't get a straight answer, of course, when I asked the ATO and ACCC some pertinent questions like, "why is eBay allowed to charge FVF on postage, and why is it legal for GST to be collected on these fees?" and so on). Finally, after educating myself on all the minutiae of Australia's tax and consumer laws, I feel pretty confident that both the Australian Government, the ACCC and eBay have been acting blindly these past several years.

I have, in fact, discovered a pre-existing law that undoes it all, proves that all of the involved parties are acting illegally, and - perhaps just as importantly - unethically. I am taking action, but I just want to get people to argue about it here first give people a heads up that hope is on the way."

What would your reaction be?

I can tell you mine - abject skepticism, unless A) the applicable laws were cited and verified, B) the actions being taken were explained, and C) how others could help advocate for the result I'm sure many would like was demonstrated. 

[kryptonite-cure-crystals]

If you understand anything about “tax write off’s”, then you would understand that this is most certainly an expense, whether you are registered or not. You don’t get anything back that is 100% tax deductible, this just means that you get to reduce your taxable income by 100% of these costs. So if your taxable income is say $30,000 and you spent $10,000 on postage then your taxable income is $20,000. You still paid the costs of postage? It just reduces the amount of tax you would be paying as this part reduces the profit you actually made. The government dont give you $10,000 back?! So it is certainly an expense and the total cost of it reduces what you actually profit. Your statement is completely naive sorry

[andrew0123]

Let's also consider the problems with the taxation system. Ebayer's like me who travel to get supplies need a log book (which gets the most money back). Are most sellers going to go to that effort to track every business movement and transaction they make? Those who run yearly totals are almost never right based on a few rounded off numbers. And if they don't and follow the law, they don't get their deductions and have to fork out their own expenses. Basically, running a business or not, you are probably making a profit on some of your items yet people just have no idea about how the systems work and are not claiming near enough deductions that they could. So, I guess it works out evenly in the end; those who do not declare income balance out with those who declare and can't be bothered following all the deduction rules. On top of this, big corporations and Foreign businesses are getting all the tax breaks. Not much motivation to start your own business and get an ABN in these conditions. But to those who do I admire the independent fortitude. 

[jwsm_oz]

No one complains about fair postage... gouging is another thing.  When sellers and eBay do the wrong thing,  it just creates more suspicion and loathing towards the platform.

There's so few items listed now,  and what is available barely gets a bid let alone a sale.  So I would think,  eBay's treatment of sellers,  gouging on fees (incl. postage),  dodgy sellers and high postage rates... is reducing trust in the product.

First thing I check is postage rates... and if they are high or suspicious... That's a NO SALE.

J

[p9games]

Lots wrong about this post.

Sole Traders can absolutely claim postage (and other) valid business expenses as deductions.  If the Sole Trader is registered for GST (Over $75k pa in sales) then GST is also claimed to offset GST on sales.

Postage is never free.  It might be a claimable expense but it is not free.  An ABN does not grant a bonus of free postage.

[p9games]

Company tax rate is now 25% (26% last year)